JesusWalk Bible Study Forum: Q1. Contending for God's Righteousness - JesusWalk Bible Study Forum

Q1. What is the basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom? How does it relate to God's character?

[QUOTE]What is the basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom? How does it relate to God's character?

It would be wrong "to kill the righteous with the wicked".

Yahweh is a righteous Elohim, therefore, Abraham demands righteousness from Yahweh.

Q1. What is the basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom? How does it relate to God's character?
To me the most amazing thing about this passage is that Abraham is face to face with God and has the confidence in his knowledge of God’s righteousness that he can bargain with him. When I read this passage I think that Abraham is making this request of God for Abraham and Lot. But the bible and this world is not about man but about God. I think this is the man-centered view of the bible. Abraham is making this request based of fact that the God of all the earth will do what is right. God gets glorified and Lot adds to the Kingdom.
I always first think that all things are about me and other people. But by prayer and reflection of things I see that it is not about me but about God. For example: The blood of Christ. I first seen the blood as a covering for my sins. This is true but the primary purpose was for God. God created man for fellowship with himself. Sin created a separation between God and man. The Blood of Christ was for an atonement (Heb 9:14) and has to do with our standing before God. God does not look upon us and overlook our sin because of the Blood but he looks upon us and see only Christ because we are covered by the Blood of Christ. After we see that the Blood was first for God then we can see that it also has great value to us. No more conscience of sins (Heb 10:2) The Blood of Jesus his son cleanses us of every sin. (1 John 1:7) By faith we now can stand before God as Abraham did knowing that the relationship between God and man has been restored. Thirdly the Blood is a weapon against Satan. When we look to the Blood of Christ and not our own hope of righteousness the accusations of Satan have no power over us and we (God and us) can silence his charges and put him to flight.
Thank you God for being righteous

What is the basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom?
Would God destroy the righteous with the unrighteous. "Shall not the God of all the earth do right"

How does it relate to God's character?
That God is a righteous God.

God Bless
Jen
Numbers 6:24-26

Abraham approached God on the basis of God’s perfect justice. It would not be just for the righteous to suffer the same judgment as the wicked. As “Judge of all the Earth”, the Lord applies justice that is governed by His overriding characteristic of holiness. What He does will always be morally blameless and perfect!

In vs. 19, the Lord said He expects His people to do right so that He can deliver His promises to them. In vs. 25, Abraham declared he knows that God will also do right as He brings those promises to reality. And the Lord would not require something of us that is not of Himself. Otherwise, He couldn’t provide it for us and would have no grounds on which to expect it of us! He is righteous and gives us His own righteousness through Christ. [1 Cor. 5:21]

The basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom is not His judgement but His mercy. Abraham does not say that there are any righteous people in Sodom or Gomorrah, he allows God to be the judge of righteousness, he asks God "if there are fifty righteous people in the city". But God's mercy does not come without test or why would He send the angels to Lot's house? Genesis 19:15 At the crack of dawn the angels urged Lot on: "Get up! Take your wife and your two daughters who are here, or you will be swept away in the punishment of the city." 16 But he hesitated, so because of the Lord's compassion for him, the men grabbed his hand, his wife's hand, and the hands of his two daughters. And they brought him out and left him outside the city. And at times, "are you certain of your choice test"; 26 But his wife looked back and became a pillar of salt.
John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life. "We have choices presented to us by God, so did Lot and his family. God in a differant way gave Lot a choice between life and death, Lot made the right choice. We too are given the choice between life and death, I pray that all would make the right choice but fear that many will not.

Darrell

Q1. What is the basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom?
Abraham's argument is that God will not kill the righteous and the wicked alike. He will spare the place to the sake of the righteous and not destroy it. He ask him about his mercy. He tells him he is not like other gods that he has mercy and he knows of Abraham's love for Lot and all Abraham has done to protect Lot already. He know Lot is a righteous man and that he lives is fear of the Lord even among the wicked Lot still lives for the Lord. He took the easy way out when him and Abraham parted because there was not enough to feed the flocks. Lot chose the way that looked the easiest so that shows that Lot put himself before Abraham but still there was love of family there a loyalty to the family. Abraham loved Lot and the Lord knew this and he would have spared the wicked for 10 righteous. But there was not even 10 to be found. God already knew there 10 would not be found but he still talk to Abraham and assured him he would spare them if he found them. He is a just and merciful God. What was Abraham thinking?


How does it relate to God's character?
God is a just God he lets the wickedness go on for the sake of the righteous. He loves those who love him and he will not let them be destroyed with the wicked. God will allow you to come boldly before him to make a case for the righteous that you love and he still today. God will talk to us still just not face to face he talks through his word we need to speak it boldly back to him. He will do what he says he will do. This world we live in now is to the point of being as Sodom was then we have to expect God to do something to stop all this sin soon. I do believe the signs of the time are there for us to see and we will see Jesus soon. This world is doing the same as they where in sodom so what else can we expect from a righteous God?

Q1. What is the basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom? How does it relate to God's character?

I love Abraham's boldness and confidence going face to face with God in intercession for the righteous. He knows God is just and fair in judgment and will push the limit. Abraham prayed based on his knowledge that God is mighty and just and could not perform an act that was not in line with those principles - he didn't pray on man's behalf - i think he prayed on God's character. Abraham knows God.

What is the basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom? How does it relate to God's character?

the basis of Abraham's argument is God's righteousness and mercy. God is righteous and merciful.

If Abraham knew the righteousness of God so well why would he question Him on it? Did he think God was headed to Sodom & Gomorah to destroy the unrighteous & righteous in such a rage He could not think straight so he had to remind God that He would be destroying righteous people also? I think we need to be careful when we declare events like the 9-1-1 attack, the tsunami & Katrina as God bringing destruction upon the world in the same way He brought destruction on Sodom. Many "righteous people" were killed during those events. How do you explain to non-christians that a just God would destroy "righteous" & innocent people to make a point?

Abraham believed in the justice of God. He did not believe that God would destroy the righteous along with the unrighteous. Therefore, he felt that he could approach God to spare Sodom if there were 10 righteous people there because he felt that God would spare the city because of the righteous people.

What is the basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom?
The bases of Abraham’s prayer is this, he is contending for the safety of his family namely Lot, and I believe for the safety of any other righteous folks if there were any.

How does it relate to God's character?
Abraham was also appealing to the Almighty God’s Sovereignty, his authority, the judge of all the earth and his righteousness

I see Abrahams speaking with the Lord, not in the sense that he was arguing, but rather pleading with Him. "If their are 50, 40, 30, 20, even 10, would you destroy them, as well? Surely the Lord who is rich in mercy and loving kindness, who had been so good, and patient with Abraham, would not deal so harshly with others!??? A question, a petition, on behalf of Lot and his family, yes...arguement, I don't think so. Because in that sense He is appealing to God's merciful nature and his request is granted. I think it's awesome that Abraham could stand face to face with the Lord, as did Moses, and boldly intercede for others. Puts me in rememberance of the scripture in Hebrews" Come BOLDLY unto the throne of grace, knowing we shall find mercy there and grace to help us in our time of need!" Now thanks to Jesus, we to can stand before our God and Boldly intercede for others!!!

Q1. What is the basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom?

Abraham's basis is his firm conviction that God is a just God and He will not allow injustice to prevail in His kingdom. He has experienced the Lord's justice in many ways and so Abraham bargains with God boldly for the lives of his kin, Lot and his family. The Lord will allow persecution, trials and tribulations in one's life so that the particular individual may increase in his personal faith and spiritual strength. That's the stepping stone for the Christian to leap forward in faith. God is a just God and He will take care of the righteous ones according to His promises in the Bible. That's why Abraham is so caught up with saving Sodom atleast for a few righteous characters, if available.

How does it relate to God's character?
God's character is just and righteous. He never allows bad things to overshadow His children. Even if He does, its only for a positive purpose of increasing thier faith. So Abraham's argument or bargaining with God perfectly gels with God's inbuilt character.

Q1. What is the basis of Abraham's agrument that God should spare Sodom?How does it relate to God's character?

To save as many righteous people as may be there. God has promised Abraham that if he will trust and obey Him, that he will be a great nation. Abraham must be a just and godly man. God knows that Abraham will do what is righteous. And so, Abraham expects God to be just Himself. "Don't kill the righteous along with the ungodly." It relates, because God is righteous. He cannot commit sin. And Abraham classes the killing of righteous people to be sinful, and so he tells God how he feels.

These studies are teaching me that I must be more bold and persevering when I pray for my loved ones who are still lost. First I must pray for a bold and persevering spirit in me. I have to learn that meekness is good when you are trying to settle a dispute, but that boldness, tempered with fortitude are needed when we are praying about something that means a lot to us. And realizing that it means a lot more to God.

Dear God, what an awesome, wonderful, omniscient Father You are.

Q1. What is the basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom? How does it relate to God's character?

There might be righteous people there who would be destroyed with the unrighteous ones. God is righteous, so how could God destroy the righteous with the righteous?
God is righteous and does not punish the righteous along with the unrighteous ones. Of course, He does not do this in this instance, either. God spares Lot and his family, although his wife looks back at the city, something God told them not to do. Obviously, her heart remained in Sodom, so she did not escape God's punishment.

Q1. What is the basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom? How does it relate to God's character?

That it would be worng to kill the righteous with the wicked and that God must treat the righteous justly. God knew that there were not many innocent people in the city but he was mercidful enough to let Abraham intercede for the sake of the few.

Q1. What is the basis of Abraham's argument that God should spare Sodom? How does it relate to God's character?

God's character which is rightous and just. A "just" God would not destroy the righteous with the wicked.

This is a very special moment as few people have stood face to facewith God and lived,so here we are able to witness a very special relationship.

Abraham was absolutely aware of God's righteousness.
Not from stories or scrolls but out of his interaction with him.

In this conversation we see God reveal his righteousness and his love for all things righteous.We also see an aproachable God who is Willing to consider the request of the righteous Abraham.

We also see mercy and grace towards Lot and family.

Aabraham pleaded that, though the wicked deserved destruction, that there were some righteous in that city who did not deserve destruction, and that the city should be saved for their sakes.

This argument assumes that God is fair and treats men according to their deeds - righteous or otherwise. It is based on Abraham's personal knowledge of God as a righteous God.