Pastor Ralph Posted August 16, 2008 Report Share Posted August 16, 2008 Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reily Posted September 20, 2008 Report Share Posted September 20, 2008 Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? Adam represents human kind by God created order Adam first. Christ was born to this world to experience the world of man so no one could say he did not know us. But more importantly to die for our transgressions so that we might be saved by grace onto God all in Adam die all in Christ have eternal life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadiejee Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? How I understand through what I have just read, Adam doesn't stand for just a man, but represents all mankind as a whole, the same as I was explaining the incident at our church where the pastor represents the congregation through his position. I'm not sure of the meaning of "by what right does Christ become head of all who become his diciples", nor do I understand the question "if Christ is not our "representative" or "head", how can his death for sins be effective for us?" I wish someone would explain this to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charisbarak Posted September 21, 2008 Report Share Posted September 21, 2008 Adam was the first human being. When he sinned, we inherited it. (If we say it's not fair, if we had been the first human being, we would have fallen into sin, the same as Adam.) Jesus is God. God, the Father sent Jesus to earth to be the God/Man. If He obeyed God the Father & did not sin, He earned the right to be our substitute on the cross and has the right to those who have accepted His free gift of grace and forgiveness--setting us right with God. He couldn't have been our head if He hadn't obeyed His Father. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? By the right that God gave Him when He created him as the first man, He became our ancestor through God since He breathed into him the same spirit that He has given to us. Jesus has become our head because He is the first tobe raised from the dead and to be found righteous in the sight of God. He died so that we may live and that makes Him our Lord and Saviour and gives Him right to be our head. With out Christ's death for us and His place as our head and Lord then we haveno part in Him and are lost. Only by our belief that He took our sins and died for us came we cometo that saving Grace that only God gives those who live and love for His Son. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pickledilly Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 Adam represents all humankind as the first human God created and the first human to rebel against God. He passed on this legacy of sin and death to every person who followed. Christ was the first and only man (setting aside His deity while physically on earth - Philippians 2:5-7) who perfectly lived an obedient righteous life, passing on a legacy of righteousness and life to every person who would accept it. This perfect life qualified Him as the only One who could atone for Adam's legacy. This establishes His "right" to be head over the group of people who believe and confess this truth. And disciples are always subordinates to their leader/teacher/mentor. If I continue in the natural state into which I was born, Adam represents my life of rebellion and its consequence of spiritual deadness to God. Either by default or choice, I'll remain in Adam's "group" (as we discussed in Question 1) with him as my representative head and inheritance. The only One who has overcome this legacy of condemnation is Christ. I can choose to accept the invitation from Christ to allow Him to move my membership to His "group", His family. Christ's death is the only thing that secured this transfer from condemnation to justification. The only way that can be effective for me and the only way I can receive His offer to make this trade is for me to submit to His headship with its inheritance of life! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delivered Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 Sorry for such a long answer, but it is such a deep question for me to answer in a few words. Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul. The first Adam was created in the image of God, and God looked on him as VERY GOOD. -- Gen 2:15 And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it. DRESS IT, is to serve it - KEEP IT, is to protect, attend to it. -- Gen 2:16 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: Gen 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge, the word comes from the root word, yaw-dah, meaning instruction, punishment, etc. of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. God gave the command to Adam, who is representing mankind, Adam was not to eat of the tree of knowledge of good =the best, and evil = the worse, wickedness. The first Adam, by his free will when tempted to disobey God's command, chose not to follow the command of God, he did not continue to serve God by KEEPING the Garden that God put under his protection. Adam did not take seriously, the importance of his leadership that God granted to him, as we see when he let his wife take and eat of the fruit first, that God commanded him not to eat of: Therefore, knowledge became real, seen in the punishment, death, separation from God, evil has come to mankind, seen in its spiritual and physical death that has ensued as righteousness was lost, no longer reconciled to God. Adam, no longer walked in the cool of the day, in fellowship with God Almighty. Adam no longer reflected God's glory, God's image was lost; therefore mankind was no longer created in God's image, but created in the image of Adam, Man, as we read in Gen 5:3 And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth. Death now reigns and it is Satan who holds the key, and has taken dominion from mankind. By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? Christ the Messiah, was born in the image of His Father, God Almighty. He came to do the will of the Father. He took the leadership that God gave Him seriously. God gave Christ the authority to take back dominion lost, to take back the keys of death and hell that was given to Satan because of Adams disobedience to God, and Adam's obededience to the voice of Satan. Christ came to give eternal life, and what is this eternal life? it is we be reconciled to God, that we would know the true God, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob; That Christ was sent to us by God, to show us the glory of God, for Christ finished the work He was sent to do. Great leadership, great example for us to follow, to be a light to those who have not been reconciled to God. If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? It can't, for the scriptures make it clear - Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. Rom 6:22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life. For us to be part of this New Covenant with God, through the Son, we have to receive this gift, who's head is represented by Christ, God's mercy for us. If Christ is our head, we must now walk in His light, His example, as we are now one in Him, and we represent God's great mercy, the Lord Christ Yeshua. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elwood C O'Dell Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 Adam represents all may kind in the fact that he was God first created being. He was also the first to willfully choose to rebel against God Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iam4-1god Posted September 22, 2008 Report Share Posted September 22, 2008 Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? Adam was flesh, just like us. He had the same right to chose as we do. Because Jesus gave His life-shed His blood-sacrificed His life for us-He became the once-and-for-all sacrifice for mankind. He gave it all up for us, so that we could be redeemed. We didn't do anything to deserve this. God wanted us to be redeemed, and this was the only way it could be done. Jesus' obedience to God The Father paved the way for us to be one with The Father. If we refuse to accept the grace and salvation that only Christ can give and has provided for, then Jesus' death for sins cannot be effective for us. There is only one way to The Father, and that is through Jesus-accepting what He did for us, and believing that He did it for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hanks Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 The offense of Adam brought condemnation to us all. As a result of his sin, human death entered the world. Death came to all Adam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reily Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? Adam is the lords first created man therefore he represents all of mankind. Christ is the first born of God in to human kind. They first adam was created a fell into sin therefore brought sin to all mankind. The second adam, not born of the will of man brought righteuosness. All who follow christ become his disciples. His death brought us to life and made us righteuos before god. Not our righteuosness but his therefore effective for us when we accept his work of salvation on the cross. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masika Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? We were all have born into Adam's physical family- the family line that leads to certaind death. All of us have reaped the result of Adam's soin. We have inherited his guilt, a sinful nature (the tendency to sin), and God's punishment. Because of Jesus however, we can trade judgement for forgiveness. Christ offers us the the oppurtunity to be born again into His Spiritual family- the family line that begins with forgiveness and leads to eternal life. If we do nothing, we receive death through Adam, but if we come to God by faith , we receive life through Christ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulcrf Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? Adam represents the death of the spirit of humankind. Christ resurrection brings abundant provision of grace and the gift of righteousness. If Christ is not our representative to God the Father, his death is useless because it was through his death that we were washed away of sins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustJeff Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 By his birthright as the first born of humankind Adam has the right to represent us as our image and nature are the same. Jesus, by His death and resurrection has the same right as first born of the dead and the Head of all disciples. It is He whom we must pattern our lives after. God forbid that anyone but Christ represent us! If we give Him a back seat to any person then we are discarding our redemption by putting a mortal, Adamic person in His place. We are following a sinful representative making His bloody sacrifice null and void. Our relationship with Him and the Father becomes dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GodExcels Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 The first Adam brought about sin, and Jesus the second Adam redeemed us from that sin. It seems that God's love for man brought about both. God loved man enough to give us free will, God then loves us enough to send Jesus to live as an example, die as propitiation for our sins, and then rise as the vein of new life and new relationship in God. Scripture states that if we do not come to God in Christ then we are not afforded the right of freedom from our sins. So by not accepting Jesus we fail to receive Him as our head and representative, our new life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickJW Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? Adam, as the first human being, represents all humankind, since from him we all are descended. Christ is the head of all who have faith in Him, and assent to the substitutionary sacrifice of the Son of God, from which we, by God's grace, enjoy forgivness of our sins. If we do not accept Christ as our representative, head, intercessor, and mediator, His death is meaningless to us, and therefore, we will not enjoy God's forgivness of our sins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janco Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 I moderate an international forum for a muscle disease caused by various mutations in the chloride channel of the skeletal muscle. In many of these types of diseases there is something called the "Founder Effect" which means everyone with a particular mutation can trace their ancestry back to one person. In terms of spiritual genetics, Adam was the "founder" of our mutation which was passed on and caused us all to be affected. It doesn't seem fair to some people, just as genetic mutations in the physical realm don't seem fair...we didn't ask for it and didn't do anything personally to bring the sentence of death on ourselves, but because we inherited that defect we are all born with the same sin nature. The good news is that we have gene therapy! Our donor, Jesus, has the perfect and complete gene that is injected and overcomes the defect (sin) that was sending us toward a certain spiritual death. Hallelujah! Jan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah43 Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? By what right does Adam represent all humankind? Adam represents all humankind because he was the first human to sin(and his wife, Eve, of course). He represents the human tendency to choose sin. By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? Christ has offered us deliverance from sin. He dwells within us as spirit, which is directing, which at once illuminates sin and leads us away from it. If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? Christ is our representative or head, as it is Him whom we follow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? Adam represents humankind because he is the first man of natural body, he was a living person & he brought us sin, Jesus has the right to become head of all because he is God and he died for us to take away our sin's. Only Christ could be our representative as he is the only perfect person to walk this earth, we would not be able to come close to the lord as we would not be redeemed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linda Stanley Posted September 24, 2008 Report Share Posted September 24, 2008 What right does Adam represent all human kind,is that we are all born into Adam's family line that leads to death(sin).When we choose to except Jesus Christ,we come out of that judgement of sin and become a follower of Jesus.Because of Jesus being obedient to His Father(God)we are able to trade judgement for forgiveness,which gives Jesus the right to become head of all who become his disciples.Jesus gave his life,so we could be born again into his spiritual family line that begins with forgiveness,and leads to eternal life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joan22 Posted September 24, 2008 Report Share Posted September 24, 2008 Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? ADAM REPRESENT ALL HUMANKIND BECAUSE ADAM WAS THE FRIST MAN, ON EARTH WHEN ADAM SIN, THE CONSEQUENCE OF ADAM SIN FALL ON ALL HUMAN KIND SO THEREFORE WE ARE BORN ON ACCOUNT OF OUR ORIGIN FROM ADAM. THEREFORE WHEN ADAM SIN WE BECAME APART OF THE CONSEQUENCE OF ADAM SIN. CHRIST BECOME HEAD OF ALL WHO BECOME HIS DISCIPLES , FOR THE MERE FACT THAT CHRIST CAME AS THE SACRIFICIAL LAMB, HE DIED FOR OUR SINS ON A CROSS, SO THAT WE WHO BELIEVED IN HIM WOULD HAVE ETERNAL LIFE. CHRIST WAS THE SECOND ADAM, WHO IN OBEDIENCE TO HIS FATHER TOOK ON THE SINS OF THIS WORLD. CHRIST IS NOW OUR ADVOCATE BETWEEN US AND GOD. NOW HE IS THE HEAD OF ALL DISCIPLES BECAUSE OF THE CROSS. IF CHRIST IS NOT OUR REPRESENTATIVE OR HEAD HIS DEATH FOR SINS CANNOT BE EFFECTIVE FOR US, BECAUSE WE WOULD NOT HAVE BELIEVE AND TRUST IN HIM SO HIS DEATH WOULD NOT BE EFFECTIVE AT ALL. BUT THANK GOD HE IS THE HEAD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soomee Posted September 24, 2008 Report Share Posted September 24, 2008 The human race is ultimately connected to Adam. The proof that we are racially connected to Adam because we all die (physical death). I think we all are wired in a way that we will give in to temptation exactly same way that Adam gave in and sinned. We are identified with Adam in "sin" and "condemnation". We need some external power to overcome sin's power dragging us down. As an example one could visualise the Newton's Law of gravity pulling things down. If an object is falling an external thing like a hand has to reach out and catch it so that it will not fall further. Similarly when we fall under the pressure of temptation we need the Spirit of Christ intervene and hold us up and give us victory over sin's power. Christ went to cross for our sins and then he had been raised from the grave to walk with newness of life. Unlike Adam, Jesus came from above and lived as a human (the same limitations that we have) and showed us that we also can have a victorious life when we are born again and use the previledge that we have via the Holy Spirit. So we are called upon to set our hearts on things above. The born again believers are identified with Christ in his death, burial and resurrection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelli WF Posted September 24, 2008 Report Share Posted September 24, 2008 If we do not accept Christ as our "head" and "representative" his death is not effective for us. By accepting that Christ died for me and acknowledging him as the head of the body I have become part of I am making the choice to follow his lead. In a body, the HEAD directs the rest of the body, all actions originate in the Head or brain. Placing Christ in this role helps me to understand that God's plan is the one I should be following. Adam was not only the original man, but represents Mankind in the death that we all lived in while separated from God because of our sins (before accepting Christ). God's cycle went from 1 man in a relationship with him who lost that relationship through a free-will choice resulting in ALL men not having that relationship. Then 1 man (Jesus) re-established the ability for all men to have a relationship with God through a free-will choice of accepting Jesus as our savior. Christ always had the right to be the head of the Body through his birthright and diety. When he came to earth and experienced the life of a human, he became our representative to the Father. His free-will choice to be obedient and be sacrificed on my behalf only solidified that right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nancychua Posted September 24, 2008 Report Share Posted September 24, 2008 Q3. (Romans 5:15-19) By what right does Adam represent all humankind? By what right does Christ become head of all who become his disciples? If Christ is not our "representative" or "head," how can his death for sins be effective for us? Adam was was the first born of humankind who has the same image, right and nature as we do. Jesus, by His death and resurrection has the same right as first born of the dead and the Head of all disciples. That why we must pattern our lives after Jeus Christ . Because Jesus gave His life for us by blood sacrifice on the cross for us, He became the once-and-for-all sacrifice for mankind. He gave it all up for us, so that we could be redeemed. We didn't do anything to deserve this. God wanted us to be redeemed, and this was the only way it could be done. Jesus' obedience to God The Father paved the way for us to be one with The Father. Jesus came from above and lived as a human to show us that we can have victorious life when we are born again and will be led by the Holy Spirit. The born again believers are identified with Christ in his death, burial and resurrection. If we refuse to accept the grace and salvation that Christ gave us, then Jesus' death for sins cannot be effective for us. The only way to The Father is through Jesus by accepting what He did for us, and believing in Him would have eternal life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haar Posted September 24, 2008 Report Share Posted September 24, 2008 We are descendant of Adam and thus have his sinful nature and have all sined. Therefore he has the rigght to represent us. Christ died for all and we are justified by his death, therefore has the right to represnt all of us. If he is not our representative, his death cannot be effective in cleansing us. That is why we have to believe that he is our saviour (representative) before we can be saved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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