Q16. Good or Bad?

[Pastor Ralph]

Q16. (Romans 3:22-23; Romans 5:12-14; Isaiah 64:6; Jeremiah 17:9) Is humankind basically “good” because of the image of God in us? Or basically evil because of deceitful hearts and our corrupt nature (“flesh”) that is “bent to sinning”?

[Jen]

Q16. (Romans 3:22-23; Romans 5:12-14; Isaiah 64:6; Jeremiah 17:9) Is humankind basically "good" because of the image of God in us? Or basically evil because of deceitful hearts and our corrupt nature ("flesh") that is "bent to sinning"? 

As long as we live we will have this corruption in us.  However if we allow the Holy Spirit who now dwells in us through faith in JesusChrist  to work His work of cleaning in us there is now given to us the power to overcome this corruption and to live as children of God (Walk before me and be holy. Genesis 17:1).  There should be evidence of a change in us that comes from the work of the Holy Spirit in us  to endeavor to live in a way to "glorify God and enjoy Him forever" as mans chief end. Westminster Catechism.

God Bless!

Jen

"Lead on O King Eternal"

[Krissi]

The predominate evil in humanity is one of the biggest stumbling blocks toward accepting Christ many secular people seem to have. Most secular people believe that people are pretty good, if left alone or raised correctly, and that any "sin" is a result of a bad environment, not something that wells up from within. 

As Christians, we know better. We know, or have been shown by the Spirit, that we are totally corrupted, that no one part of us is free from the tendency to sin. 

[BoazNigel]

This is a complex question - we were all created in the image of God "CHRIST LIVES WITHIN YOU so even though your body will die because of sin, the Spirit gives you life" (Rom 8:10, NLT) yet "everyone has sinned, we ALL fall short of God's glorious standard" (Rom 3:23, NLT)

As Grudem wrote 'every part of our being is affected by sin'

While we have God indwelling us (by His Holy Spirit) - the image of God (His goodness) is encased & distorted by the Fall/Sin

Praise God for Jesus & grace that offers us salvation despite our 'fallen-ness''

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqSvTJeGU0k

 

[t-c]

I think that one of the greatest lies of the evil one and it comes from the theory of evolution,  is that people are actually getting better. Like if we just wait long enough we would have peace on earth with everyone happy, living in perfect societal harmony. I don’t know how anyone could look at the world and think people are getting better.

The truth is that we haven’t changed a bit since the fall. And apart for God there is no good in us. We are all products of the world, the flesh and the devil and without God we are doomed. If there is any good in me it’s because I’ve put my faith, hope and trust in Jesus Christ for my salvation. He gave me new life and a restored relationship with God the Father. Apart from Christ there is no good in me.
 

[hanks]

Q16. (Romans 3:22-23; Romans 5:12-14; Isaiah 64:6; Jeremiah 17:9) 
Is humankind basically "good" because of the image of God in us? Or basically evil because of deceitful hearts and our corrupt nature ("flesh") that is "bent to sinning"? 
Psalm 12:2-3 answers the question: “The LORD looks down from heaven on the sons of men to see if there are any who understand, any who seek God. All have turned aside, they have together become corrupt; there is no-one who does good, not even one”. Although we were made in the image of God, this image has been mostly corrupted by our inherited sin, and there is now no-one who does good. Even our best efforts are still infected with sin, so much so that our righteousness is but filthy rags compared to God’s infinite righteousness. Our deceitful hearts and desperately wicked nature shows that we are basically evil, and we deserve only God’s wrath (Eph 2:3). Our hearts often deceive us, by leading us astray to rebel, to disobey, to sin, and to demand things we don’t need; leading to great sorrow by giving us false keys to happiness. Even to not fully understanding our own heart. We are dead in our sins (Eph 2:1). Fortunately, because of God’s great love for us we are made new creations in His likeness through our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ (2 Cor 5:17). We repent and put our trust in Him - are forgiven and receive eternal life. "For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life” (John 3:16). 
 

[Diane D.]

• Humankind, unfortunately, is basically bad which is an inherited attribute in our spiritual DNA which cannot be eliminated in our natural natures.  We have to become a new creature and our heart replaced with a new heart.  No fixing this.  That being said, we can become aware of God's kingdom and follow the example of his Son which exercises that other part of our citizenship:  that being Heaven.

 

• Jen, thanks for your quote on the Holy Spirit: 
• As long as we live we will have this corruption in us.  However if we allow the Holy Spirit who now dwells in us through faith in Jesus Christ  to work His work of cleaning in us there is now given to us the power to overcome this corruption and to live as children of God (Walk before me and be holy. Genesis 17:1).  There should be evidence of a change in us that comes from the work of the Holy Spirit in us  to endeavor to live in a way to "glorify God and enjoy Him forever" as mans chief end. Westminster Catechism.
• I want to get into a serious study of the role of the Holy Spirit and will check this out further.  Point well taken.

[Rob Mc.]

From the beginning, God wanted man to remain totally in His image and likeness.  He wanted him to remain sin free, working Eden as he planned, living an abundant life, raising children and populating the planet with sin-free humans.  Then the apple fell… and so did Adam (via Eve). 

From that point onward, via man’s free will, humans became sinners.  Not just sometimes, but constantly; their (our) thoughts, actions and behaviors are driven by the flesh.  What can I accomplish?  What can YOU do for ME?  I need this, I want this, I will get it, even if it hurts you!

God knew even then that He needed a revised plan if mankind was ever going to revert to His original creation. Several times he drove Israel into situations were there was temptation, with the hope that there would be internal change, resulting in a return to Him.  At first they did return to God, but eventually the desires of the flesh won out.  Finally, God put “Plan Christ” into motion.  The OT prophets began to receive and record the Word of God containing stories of the coming of a new King, the Last King.  Hopefully THIS would prepare the world to receive His Son.

Then, from the line of Abraham and David, God presented Jesus to the world, giving Mankind an error-proof way to receive His Grace, return to Him and FINALLY be the people he visualized at creation.  Now the onus shifted from man to Christ, and though we remain sinners, there is a clear way back to God, and a life of eternity.  We just have to believe, trust and receive.  Thank God, or we would be lost forever…

[Lottie]

Q16. (Romans 3:22-23; Romans 5:12-14; Isaiah 64:6; Jeremiah 17:9) Is humankind basically "good" because of the image of God in us? Or basically evil because of deceitful hearts and our corrupt nature ("flesh") that is "bent to sinning"? I believe we are a mix of both good and evil, Good that is still in us from our creator and evil from the fall itself. We may be able to do good deeds but deep inside we still have bad thoughts and are capable of doing bad things like hurting others we love. We are capable of sinning due to our sinful nature in us and we need the Holy Spirit to help us defeat that desire. Without being saved and having God's Spirit within we are utterly unable to overcome the sinful nature. Sinful man may do good deeds but they are not really altruisitc. Sometimes they are done out of pride so others will say how good he is. But we can overcome this by turning it over to God. He who is in us is greater than he who is in the world.

[Janzie]

On 10/6/2022 at 7:34 PM, Pastor Ralph said:

Q16. (Romans 3:22-23; Romans 5:12-14; Isaiah 64:6; Jeremiah 17:9) Is humankind basically “good” because of the image of God in us? Or basically evil because of deceitful hearts and our corrupt nature (“flesh”) that is “bent to sinning”?

      The Bible says that - All have sinned and come short of the glory of God. (Romans 3:23)   There is none righteous, no not one - (Romans 3:10) But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.   I Corinthians 2:14                        Adam's transgression:   Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned    Romans 5:12                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Christ- the Last Adam:  But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

 

When someone tells us about Jesus and that he loved us enough to die in our place and take our sins on the cross and forgive us, and we believe and receive Christ as our Savior and Lord, we are born again. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.   2 Corinthians 5:17 After Christ was resurrected and went to the Father, He sent us His Holy Spirit to live in us. (1Corinthians 6:19) Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?
Yes, we can chose to sin, but the Holy Spirit  gives us the ability to make the right choice and not sin, to choose right.  

[Katy]

Q.16. We were made in the imagine of God but because of the ‘fall’, we now have corrupt and deceptive hearts. All our thoughts words and deeds have an element of corruption or deceitfulness  about them. Jeremiah 17v9 The heart is deceitful above all things and beyond cure. Who can understand it?. When we become Christians and give our lives to Jesus we become ‘New Creations’ because of God’s great love and graciousness towards us. Unfortunately we will always have Satan trying to pull us away from God and the things of God. This will go on for as long as we live. But by God’s grace we will endure and fight the good fight and focus on God to enable us to do the things we should do and overcome our corrupt and sinful hearts. I think we have both good and evil in us , but we do have to fight consistently to overcome our evil hearts and our sinfulness and allow the inherent good in us to show. 

[haar]

Q16. (Romans 3:22-23; Romans 5:12-14; Isaiah 64:6; Jeremiah 17:9) Is humankind basically "good" because of the image of God in us? Or basically evil because of deceitful hearts and our corrupt nature ("flesh") that is "bent to sinning"?

The human being is by nature sinful due to the Adamic nature but thank God for his grace that makes us acceptable as the redeemed of the Lord through faith in Christ.
 

[Irmela]

Q16. (Romans 3:22-23; Romans 5:12-14; Isaiah 64:6; Jeremiah 17:9)

Is humankind basically "good" because of the image of God in us?     Because of sin that image has been tainted.

Or basically evil because of deceitful hearts and our corrupt nature ("flesh") that is "bent to sinning"?

Much has been said about this.  Romans 3:23 states clearly that all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.  No one reaches the place where he is good enough to still be called good, without the righteousness of Christ.  [Our own righteousness, is like a filthy garment  .  .  .   it is repulsive.]    This righteousness of Christ can be seen as a garment, which is available to all but only comes on those who believe.  It is needed by everyone, for all have sinned .   .   .  This righteousness comes to us through our faith in Christ.     

[lighthouse2014]

Even though humankind was created in the image God, we have fallen into sin and have become morally corrupt. Mans heart is hardened and is opposed to Gods righteousness. Though some good resides in man he is incapable of pleasing God unless God helps him through the holy spirit.

[Debra Grant]

Q16. (Romans 3:22-23; Romans 5:12-14; Isaiah 64:6; Jeremiah 17:9) Is humankind basically “good” because of the image of God in us? Or basically evil because of deceitful hearts and our corrupt nature (“flesh”) that is “bent to sinning”?

1. We all have sinned and came short of the glory of God. Therefore, because of sin there is no good thing in the flesh. The Holy Ghost is our help to do what is right.

2. There is some good in man when following the fruit of the Spirit of God in us which also is done with the Holy Ghost in us.

[Zanele Tlhakanelo]

I believe that from Creation, humankind was basically good that is why God made us in His image and after His likeness. God had a good relationship with Adam and gave him dominion over everything. Sin creeped in and because of disobedience, when the serpent deceived Eve into eating the Tree of Knowledge which she shared with her husband. Even if we have been saved by grace, we continue to sin through our actions, thoughts and our speech but that does not nullify us as been good people.

Our corrupt nature, the flesh, that is bent to sinning caused us to be corruptible. But thank God to the incorruptible seed who was His Son, came and redeemed us from destruction. We surely survive because of God's undeserved kindness and therefore all those who believe that Christ paid the price for us, have received pardon but not of our own work but by His grace. The Word of God says "the just shall live by faith". We have been justified by what Jesus Christ said on the cross " It is finished". 

[pickledilly]

From the very beginning of Scripture, the record is clear that after the fall of Adam and Eve into rebellion and rejection of God’s Word to them, all humanity has inherited the resulting corruption of God’s image in us. God is certainly not corrupt, but His image in mankind is now utterly distorted and tainted with our depravity. We’re born with a spiritual deadness to Him, which can only leave us with deceitful hearts and a wretched sinful inner nature. Sin is our natural default, and there is no rescue or deliverance apart from the loving grace of God manifested in our Redeemer.

[blezed]

Q16. (Romans 3:22-23; Romans 5:12-14; Isaiah 64:6; Jeremiah 17:9) Is humankind basically “good” because of the image of God in us? Or basically evil because of deceitful hearts and our corrupt nature (“flesh”) that is “bent to sinning”?

We all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. Nothing good lives in us because of our sinful nature.  It is only by God's grace that we are saved.

[JOLLAM BANDA]

As a consequence of the Fall of man, every person born into the world is morally corrupt, enslaved to sin and is, apart from the grace of God, utterly unable to choose to follow God or choose to turn to Christ in faith for salvation. Though humans were created in God's image (Genesis 1:26-27), humankind soon fell into sin, resulting in God's curse and the fall of man (Genesis 3). Thus, while elements of God's image surely remain in us, his image and goodness are now distorted, bent, leaving us incapable of pleasing God with pure, unmixed motives. Yes, outwardly our actions can be good most of the time, but inwardly, without Christ's help, we are compromised.

[Old Jerry]

No, humankind is not basically “good” because of the image of God in us. It might be that the image of God in us that can help us with our deceitful heats and corrupt nature, but that is only because of God’s grace.

[Lisa Wolf]

Q16. (Romans 3:22-23; Romans 5:12-14; Isaiah 64:6; Jeremiah 17:9) Is humankind basically “good” because of the image of God in us? Or basically evil because of deceitful hearts and our corrupt nature (“flesh”) that is “bent to sinning”? 

Humans are made in the image of God.  He made us for good.  He made us for holiness.  His command is eternal life. (John 12:50; 1John 3:23) Humans choose sin.  Great job mentioning being around small children.  With my own I remember thinking, "I did not teach them to do this rebellion!"  They just figured it out on their own--these tiny cute creatures.  So my answer is Both:  "good" and "bent on sinning."