Pastor Ralph Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 Q2. What does this tell us about the Father? The Father is the speaker here in 1:8 and in 21:6. But Jesus is the speaker in 1:17 and 22:12-13. What is the significance of this for our understanding of who Jesus is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biblereader Posted September 13, 2003 Report Share Posted September 13, 2003 How do we know that the Father is the speaker in 1:8 and 21:6? How do we know that Jesus is the speaker in 1:17 and 22:12-13? The Bible that I am reading has Jesus' words in red. The publishers of the Bible that I am reading show 1:8, 1:17, 22:12-13 as Jesus' speaking as indicated in red and only 21:6 as the Father speaking, which is different from from the view taken in Q2. Nevertheless, it is evident that both the Father and Jesus are eternal and have been alive before the foundation of the world (John 17:24). The only connection to the eternal Father is thru Jesus (John 14:6, 11). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redeemed1 Posted September 13, 2003 Report Share Posted September 13, 2003 1:8 "'I am the Alpha and the Omega', says the Lord God, 'who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.'" In Revelation more than any other book (in my opinion) Jesus is revealed in a way that *clearly* shows his sovereignty and his equality with the Father. Even other sects that deny the diety of Christ (that claim he is not, in fact, God) have difficulty explaining why Jesus says he is the First and Last(1:17) just as the Father in 21:6 says he is the Beginning and the End. They are one and the same. This is all significant towards understanding who Jesus is because it shows his power and his never-ending love for us. The power that only the Almighty has, the Living One, "I was dead, and behold I am alive for ever and ever!"(1:18) his love is shown in the awesome sacrifice he made in humbling Himself just to be with us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linda Stanley Posted September 14, 2003 Report Share Posted September 14, 2003 This tells us the Father is the Beginning and the End,the completeness and totality of God The Almighty.Christ speaks with identical expression in meaning the same,which sets Jesus Christ apart from all created being.None other than God could share in the titles of God, is to my understanding of who Jesus is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE FISH Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 This is testimony of the Holy Trinity. The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit. In the end of time, according to Scripture Jesus will sit at the right hand of God. Amen, Come Lord Jesus. The grace of the Lord Jesus be with God's people. Amen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liza Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 The Father is 'the Alpha and the Omega, who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty'. One verse, such power! He has always existed, and is beyond time. He is constant, and all powerful! Jesus is the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End, the Alpha and the Omega. The Father and the Son are identical in nature - one is not lesser or greater than the other. I think those who had walked and talked with Jesus needed to understand His Deity - He is God. And sometimes even I need to remember His Holiness, Righteousness, Judgement and Power - not just His sacrifice and love and tenderness. We are servants of the God who is omnipotent, omnipresent and omniscient, and servants have responsibilities. Our understanding of our Lord will help us to live our lives in a manner that is worthy of Him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helen Spaulding Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 This passage tells us that God is, has been and always will exist. He is eternal. In the passages about Jesus, it is made clear that He and the Father are both God--One yet three in one! Jesus was in existance and participated in the creation, as was the Spirit. John makes this clear in his Gospel. So, we can know Jesus as our Lord and God who loves us so much He was willing to share human life and suffer and die for us! How shocking--and how humbling--to realize! That the Lord of all existance could love us that much! Wonderful! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linda biloni Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 Having never noticed the similarity in what God said and what Jesus said before, this in itself was a revealation to me. I have been taught the Trinity and this would seem to confirm it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DellaJ Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 This tells us that God and Jesus is one in the same. Jesus is God in the human form. Jesus says He is the first and last, God says He is the beginning and the end, Alpha and Omega. God and Jesus cannot be seperated. Sometimes it is easy for me to think of Jesus as a kind of "pushover". He loves me so much that He died for me and He is always ready to forgive me. Instead of remembering that Jesus is God and should have the same amount of Holy fear from me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cct1106 Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 Q2. What does this tell us about the Father? The Father is the speaker here in 1:8 and in 21:6. But Jesus is the speaker in 1:17 and 22:12-13. What is the significance of this for our understanding of who Jesus is? Verse 8 says "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending so that the Lord which is and which was and which is to come, the Almighty and in 21:6 he said unto me it is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athrist of the fountain of the water of life freely. Basically, Since Jesus died for our sins he is rewarded to give every man according as his work shall be. Jesus fell at God's feet as dead and God placed his right hand upon him saying "fear not; I am the first and the last." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophet Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 Well ill have to say this shows us that God an Jesus is one an the same yet there is at times a parting between them Jesus talked with God an only did an said what he heard or saw the father do an GOD spoke out of heaven for humans an for us to be able to see him as he is the 1st an last begining an the end God is the spirit in heaven an Jesus is the flesh on earth that was filled with Gods spirit an thats where the power comes from an when Jesus left he gave us the power to do the work of the lord GRACE SAVED BY GRACE i think grace is the power of GOD enableing us to become all he made us to be and to do all he has for us to do Its how Jesus did it and its only by the power given to Jesus by God that we can do all things in Christ Once again i think they are one in the same but yet apart at times grace & peace unto you all a brither in Christ love always joe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaunita Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 What does this tell us about the Father? The Father is the speaker here in 1:8 and in 21:6. But Jesus is the speaker in 1:17 and 22:12-13. What is the significance of this for our understanding of who Jesus is? 'And God said..'Let "US" make man, after OUR likeness.....' Gen.1:26 'In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God'...Jn.1:1 Jn.1:2 goes on to say, that the same (the Word) was in the beginning with God, so this is telling us, Jesus was, is, and always will be. When God, the Father spoke the world into existence, Jesus, Himself, was the 'Word' spoken, from the mouth of God; The trinity is one of the mysteries to be sure! Only through the revelation of the Spirit, are we able to comprehend this mystery...and even then, its hard to put into words... In a class I was teaching, some years ago, the way I explained it was this way; Just as we..mankind, are a 'trinity'...body, soul and spirit, so is God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The difference being, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, have always, and will always, operate as One, in all things. We as body soul and spirit, can become "fragmented"..not working in unision. It is only through accepting Jesus as Lord and Saviour, do we become 'one' ...whole, within ourselves, because of Him, and in Him. "What is the significance of this for our understanding of who Jesus is?" Jesus and the Father are one...for all that the Father is, and has...belongs to The Son...power, authority, etc. When we listen to Jesus, we are listening to the Father. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blb Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 I believe this tells us that God is the Father and Jesus is the son, the one who came to give his life for our salvation. But it also tells us that God was before anything and that he is now and will be forever . And I believe that this assures us of our eternal life if we believe on Him. Also it tells us that God is the almighty of all things large and small. We could be expounding on this to the point of confusion, but is not what God wants us to do, after all does he not say that He is not the author of confusion ? This is to reinforce our Faith, Verse upon verse ect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joy Wright Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 The Lord God--the Father, is the beginning and the end. Jesus also is the first and the last. Jesus said, "I and the Father are one." Here is a representation of both God the Father and Jesus as eternal beings. We are given the Scripture to explain who the Father is in relation to the Son. I have never been able to fully grasp the Trinity (too incomprehensible for my finite mind). Are they one Being, or three beings in One (in spirit)? I know that the significance of these words in Revelation are that when the Father was there, so was His Son. "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word WAS WITH God, and the Word WAS God," John 1:1. Our Savior, who went through the cross for us, is eternal. He has always been here. He IS God. That in itself, is truly amazing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darleen Nelson Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 The Father is the Lord from beginning to end--eternal. Without Him there is no beginning and no end. He is the beginning and end of existence, wisdom and power. jesus is the one who gives us power to overcome anything. He holds the key to death and the grave. He has set us free from Satan's control. We must understand that we need to place our life in Jesus' hands and in this way we receive eternal life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrierchick Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 question 1 tells us the Father has always been here. He is the beginning & the end. But Jesus also calls Himself the Alpha & the Omega, so that tells us Jesus also has always been here. It means to me they are both eternal & forever. Both God & one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jesus4al Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 My Bible doesn't have the words that Jesus spoke written in red. Therefore, I was assuming that the significance had to do with the question: as to who said I am the first and the last. After reading the various posts ... now I say that the significance is that Jesus the Son and God the Father are one. If that is wrong will someone please let me know? Love ...Bro. Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccs Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 Q2. What does this tell us about the Father? The Father is the speaker here in 1:8 and in 21:6. But Jesus is the speaker in 1:17 and 22:12-13. What is the significance of this for our understanding of who Jesus is? a. That He is the Alpha and the Omega, the Begining and the End says the Lord, who is and who was and who is to come. He is the Almighty! I am not clear on who was the speaker is in 1:8 & 21:6, but I am clear on the speaker in 1:17 & 22 12-13. and the significance of the Father and Son. b. They are both the Alpha and the Omega, they have always been, they are the sane yesterday, today and to come. They are eternal, and they are one, I am He!. God can not lie, therefore, there is only one God; both He and Jesus are the same, the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. God the Father representing himself in different ways, but with the same power and might that has always been. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helen Williams Posted September 15, 2003 Report Share Posted September 15, 2003 Rev. 1:8 (Father). I an alpha and omega, the beginning and the end, which is, and which was, which is to come. Jesus said,"when you see me you have seen the Father." To me Jesus showes the true character of who God really is: THE FATHER, THE SON, THE HOLY GHOST. All is one and eternal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cath'rine Posted September 16, 2003 Report Share Posted September 16, 2003 It tells us He is the Alpha and Omega Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie Posted September 16, 2003 Report Share Posted September 16, 2003 What does 1:8 tell us about the Father? First and Last-The Beginning and the End What is the importance of this? Shows that Jesus and God are One Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SharonK Posted September 16, 2003 Report Share Posted September 16, 2003 Greetings All...Isn't our God and Awesome God..... Alpha ans Omega...The Beginning and the End....He was and He is....He is the First and the Last..... John 1:1.....In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God....v2....He was in the begining with God....v14....And the Word became flesh and dwelt amoung us and we beheld His glory...the glory as of the only begotten of the Father...full of grace and truth..... John 10:30 I and the Father are one 1 Corinthians 2:13...Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God. the three are ONE......Praise God!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TennLady01 Posted September 16, 2003 Report Share Posted September 16, 2003 It tells us he was not formed he always was and always will be no beginning and no end to him. The Father is to come he did not come to this earth he sent his son Jesus therefore it is the Father that is speaking here or he would not have said is to come. Jesus has already been here. In 21-6 God was the one that took away the water of eternal life it would be God that shall give it unto us the water of life again that we shall never die. Rev 1-17 Jesus is the first and the last he is the only one to have been born and to have been raised from the tomb to live forever more. Rev 22: 12&13 Jesus is going to return to this earth and he has promised to reward those that have done his work. He is the was always and will forever be. This shows us that Jesus just as the Father was always he was the one that walked this earth and he shall return for the faithful and will reward those that do his will. He is our Lord and Savior. Praise his Holy name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DebChats Posted September 16, 2003 Report Share Posted September 16, 2003 This tells me that God is saying .. What God has begun, God will finish to the end. 1:17 - Jesus is referring to His being the first of ALL - first death, first life, first resurrection, first begotten, etc. - And He will be the last to be first. There can and will be no other Messiah's. This is Jesus as the man Jesus Christ. 22:12-13 - This is Jesus of the Godhead - He and the Father are One. This is Jesus as God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine Miller Posted September 16, 2003 Report Share Posted September 16, 2003 Q2. What does this tell us about the Father? The Father is the speaker here in 1:8 and in 21:6. But Jesus is the speaker in 1:17 and 22:12-13. What is the significance of this for our understanding of who Jesus is? John begins to speak of what he was told to write and with what he saw as he was in the Spirit of the Lord... v8... I am Alpha, Omega, Begining, Ending saith the Lord. Which Is, Was, and Is to Come: the Almighty. Note: John does not implicate yet that he saw; only heard. V10... being in the Spirit on the Lord's day and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet. V11... repeats with I am Alpha, Omega, First, Last. V12... and I turn to see that voice spake with me... seeing SEVEN Golden Candlesticks... v13 and in the MIDST of the SEVEN Candelsticks... One like unto the Son of Man. v15... and His voice as the sound of many waters v16... holding 7 stars, out of His a mouth a Two Edged Sword... a countenance as the sun shineth. v17... Fear Not... I am the First and the Last. v18... I Am He that liveth, was dead, and am Alive for evermore... holding the keys of hell and death. Honestly, as I read this I understand it as God speaking to John by way of the Holy Spirit; though John does not see God; the Father... John does turn from where the voice came and sees One like the Son of Man in the midst of the 7 candlesticks... 7 spirits of God. The one John actually sees is Jesus and as Jesus speaks like many waters... Jesus reveals to John He ( Jesus ) also answers like God; the Father. John gives testimonial to the Voice he hears in thunderous tone... saying the same things... I Am, the Begining, the Ending, Which was, Which is, and Which is to Come. John gives testimonial to hearing the words from the many waters saying "Fear Not; I am the First and Last... liveth, was Dead, I am Alive and for evermore, having the keys to hell and death. A witness to the Testimony of Jesus; now John stands before Him and not only has heard, but sees also. God witnesses to me in Spirit that no one has ever seen Him; yet revealing Himself to us by way of Jesus; His Son. John is the Bearing Witness of Testimony here; Jesus being the Witness of Testimony for John; The Holy Spirit living in John bears witness to be able to see and hear both the voice of God and the voice of Jesus... which both being the same as ONE... all three: God, Jesus, and Holy Spirit being of the SAME; One. I see the Holy Spirit speaking here for John, God speaking through the Holy Spirit to John, and Jesus speaking for God; the Father. God, Jesus and Holy Spirit have been together from the Begining and will be together forevermore. with love in Him; and for the truth of the word.... sunshine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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