Pastor Ralph Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Q2. (1 Corinthians 9:13-14) Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor – and, if possible, other workers? What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pickledilly Posted April 15, 2014 Report Share Posted April 15, 2014 I see this command as a parallel to the O.T. command to the priesthood that the priests were to rely on the gifts brought to the LORD for their own provision and sustenance. And once again we see how Christ now call us to voluntary Spirit-led obedience to the tenets of God’s Law, which transcends legalistic obligations to the written legal code that He fulfilled and ended. As we are now to be guided by the supreme overruling directive of LOVE for God and others which leads us to obey His commands (Matt.22:37-40; John 14:21;15:12), we must pay attention to Paul’s comments on this parallel. As the disciples traveled to fulfill their calling to preach the gospel, they were to completely rely on the hospitality of worthy host families. This would mean at least two things. 1) They would not have to divide their efforts and attention to the mission with finding jobs to support themselves. This ministry was to be their work and passion. 2) I think God wanted to them to trust Him completely as their Provider, which was the lesson to the Levites who were not allowed an inheritance of land as means to support themselves. The Israelites offered their mandated tithes/offerings (a parallel to Christ's new application through Spirit-led free-will giving) that God then apportioned to those whose work was representing Him to the people. Paul’s instruction is an obvious obligation for Christian congregations to support their pastoral staff to the best of their ability and means. As a volunteer pianist for 20+ years in my former church, I was strongly convicted of how wrong it was to allow the congregation to shirk this obligation when I was also asked to oversee/direct our choir and music ministries for over 6 years. This scripture passage along with Matt.10:9-10 and Luke 10:7 showed me clearly what was “due” to workers who sacrifice many other opportunities in order to serve in that way – AND the responsibility of a congregation to provide and not inadvertently take advantage of someone. Going back to that parallel with the O.T. priesthood, the Body of Christ is now priesthood who offers the sacrifices that support their spiritual leaders and ministers of the gospel (1Peter 2:5,9). Today our sacrifices of giving are just as holy unto God as those offered by Israel through the Levites, and any church board or congregation who does not respect and rightly allocate them will ultimately be accountable to the LORD Himself. It would violate His Law of Love to do anything less. I do have to confess one dilemma in considering if there is any difference in the obligation to support ministers of the gospel who rely on that to live and an obligation to sacrificially support a pastor who has amassed quite comfortable wealth through outside endeavors and teaches a workshop every year on how to become debt-free through owning real estate. He wears the nicest of suits, drives the latest truck models, lives in a very nice lakeside home, owns vacation beach property, etc. He does not rely on the salary from the church for his support. There’s nothing wrong with hard work and having things, but I’ve sensed a controlling and fearful spirit in him, and the feeling that deep-down he relies on himself and his efforts rather than completely depending on God through the people of our large congregation. (He also teaches a legalistic view of money.) Hmmm. Not sure exactly what to think in terms of obligation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanMary Posted May 3, 2014 Report Share Posted May 3, 2014 Q2. (1 Corinthians 9:13-14) Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? Jesus' disciples were the first missionaries sent out to share the Gospel, with no means of support other than God's provision through those hearing their message. Just as the O.T. priests were provided for from the offerings and sacrifices given in the temple for their full time service...Jesus was training them to depend upon God alone. What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor – and, if possible, other workers? Just as Jesus taught regarding those in ministry being supported by those being ministered to, Christians are to follow the example of how the Lord provided for the priests serving in the temple, and for His disciples (missionaries and other workers) who were sent out with an empty purse, to be provided for by those whose lives were impacted. What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? I'm not sure how to answer this....other than that they may be disciplined here on earth for their rebellion. I was thinking of another church board who was directed by the pastor to pay his wife $100,000 per year for heading up the small children's ministry, (this was kept secret from the congregation) while he boasted that he took no salary, choosing to live on his former NFL retirement. That pastor and church board have been and are being disciplined (corrected?) through most of the congregation leaving when this and other financial "discrepancies" as well as moral issues were revealed. That pastor is still preaching to a small group which stayed and a few newcomers who don't know what has gone on there. They are now in the large facility which was leased and remodeled through outright lies, smoke and mirrors financial disclosures, as well as secret meetings where the board called together only the "high rollers" (their name for very wealthy people) and then high pressured each of them to "contribute" a minimum of $15,000 but could not reveal the reason for the "need". To their credit, most of them left the church after that meeting, and many board members as well as several deacons and elders. We also left at that time. The current congregation is now saddled with an enormous debt, community disdain, a disgruntled and disillusioned land lord, and whatever is yet to come in the form of discipline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charisbarak Posted May 5, 2014 Report Share Posted May 5, 2014 Jesus wanted them to depend wholly upon God for what they needed. He knows & will move others to supply their needs. God wants us to take care of those who serve us. They are totally answerable to God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lion of Grace Posted May 5, 2014 Report Share Posted May 5, 2014 Jesus commanded the disciples to receive support from families on their journey because He was sending them out empty handed! They were not to take any silver or gold, no bag for the journey, no extra clothes, sandals or a staff. They were to go out and to be totally dependent on God's provision through other believers! Christian congregations are to be moved to give Godly provision to those who are in ministry so they can do the work of ministry. Full time ministers need an income so they can go about the call on their lives. However, I don't see this meaning to over provide for ministers or a means of anyone getting rich. I do see the need to support those who are truly called but am cautious of being involved in supporting those who say they have a call, but jockey around to find the church that pays the most or where they will be promoted quickly to a better social status within the church. The disciples were going out with nothing to preach the Gospel. They were merely accepting care and provision on their journey to do this. Accountability to paying church leaders less (and even more than they should) will fall into the hands of God. If leadership has decided to not pay a Pastor an amount that will serve in providing for an honest living and as a means for him to answer a call, the church will most likely suffer the loss of a Pastor and good shepherd and they will eventually see no one willing to come and lead. If they overpay they will attract those seeking for a good job in an economic market and will most likely suffer the affects of greed and being led by a heart not committed to Christ but to money. They will cease to be a true church. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sank T Monius Posted May 5, 2014 Report Share Posted May 5, 2014 1 Corinthians 9:13-14 Q). Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? A). Jesus commanded his disciples to receive support on their journeys because they are worthy of the support: "And in the same house remain, eating and drinking such things as they give: for the labourer is worthy of his hire..." (Luke 10:7) # Q). What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor -- and, if possible, other workers? A). The scriptural obligation to support the pastor is stated in this verse: "Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar? Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel." (1 Corinthians 9:13-14) # Q). What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? A). God requires wage-justice of church board members and will hold them accountable for this on judgment day. (see Luke 10:7) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hanks Posted May 6, 2014 Report Share Posted May 6, 2014 Q2. (1 Corinthians 9:13-14) Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor - and, if possible, other workers? What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? Those that preach the Word are servants of God’s Word, and have been called to that glorious task and have been ordained to devote themselves completely to the ministry of the Word. They are, as such, in full-time ministry and are therefore fully entitled to get their living from the gospel. The Lord has instructed us to provide for the preacher’s needs and it obviously must be sufficient to support himself and the members of his family. As far as the congregation is concerned, if we love the Lord we will obey His commands (John 14:15), so the obligation is on us to ensure that our Pastor is adequately provided for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinstonY Posted May 6, 2014 Report Share Posted May 6, 2014 Question 2 There ate several reasons why Jesus commanded his disciples to receive thete support from the people to whom they preached. 1. The priests of the temple by the law of Moses were owef a portion of each sacrifice performed at the temple. This allowed them to live a life of luxry compared to the poor. Jesus saw his news as good news and should thus be awarded their food and lodging. 2. It was a tradition of tje timr that the bearer of good news should be rewarded. As the disciples bore good news they should be received joufully and hence be rewarded with food and lodging. Scriptural reference s include 1 corinthians 9. 10 to 14, john 14.1.6 and 12.6 and 13 to 29, Luke 10.7 and 25 to 38, also 9 1 to5, lev 7.8 and3.3 to 5, 1 corinthians 9. 10 to 14. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IvoryEagle Posted May 7, 2014 Report Share Posted May 7, 2014 Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? HE DID NOT WANT THEM EXPENDING ENERGY SEEKING SUPPORT BUT DELIVERING THE GOSPEL. What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor – and, if possible, other workers? "The elders who direct the affairs of the church well are worthy of double honor, especially those whose work is preaching and teaching. For the Scripture says, 'Do not muzzle the ox while it is treading out the grain,' and 'The worker deserves his wages.'330" (1 Timothy 5:17-18) What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? THEY WILL LOSE THEM AND SUBJECT THE CHURCH TO LESS THAN THEY CAN EXPECT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parkerslope Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? He wanted them to spend their time teaching people about the coming kingdom of Heaven, not working to earn money to live on. What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor - and, if possible other workers? 1 Corinthians 9:14 tells us that the one who preaches and teaches the gospel is worthy to be paid. Also saying that, "if a worker speaks spiritual things to people, they should provide physical things in return." What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? It reminds me of the "preachers" who are rich from the income of people donating to God. A worker is worthy of being paid for his work, not too little nor too much. Money has become a god to too many preachers who think that:"they know it all". All church leaders are accountable! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lighthouse2014 Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 Q2. (1 Corinthians 9:13-14) Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor – and, if possible, other workers? What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? Jesus commanded His disciples to receive support from people while on their journey proclaiming the gospel because a worker is due his wages. The scripture teaches Christians are obligated to support their pastors and workers as n the Old Testament. No tithes no church. If the church board does not pay their pastors a reasonable amount of pay, he will move on to another church that will support him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
van Posted May 10, 2014 Report Share Posted May 10, 2014 Jesus was teaching the disciples to rely on those people whom they minister to for support. If you are giving spiritual food to your congregation, Paul states that they are to supply you with material support. Jesus even stated that if you are a preacher of the gospel, you ought to receive material support. It is the duty of the congregation to support their pastor and God will hold those congregations accountable for not doing so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Jerry Posted May 12, 2014 Report Share Posted May 12, 2014 Jesus commanded his disciples to receive support on their journey because they were to take nothing with them. They were to see who was really loved the Lord and were will to support the gospel that they were preaching. The scriptural obligation that Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastors and other workers that the Bible says that they are to reap the fruit of their labor. Their labor is spreading the Word and their fruit should be material blessings. The accountability that the church board members will experience when they pay their pastors less than they should will be that they will have to justify themselves on the judgment day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Beenleigh Posted May 17, 2014 Report Share Posted May 17, 2014 Why did Jesus command His disciples to receive support on their journeys? To learn to trust in God for all provisions, to concentrate their efforts in spreading the Word and to be humble in accepting the generosity of their hosts. What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor-- and if possible , other workers? 1 Cor. 9:14" the Lord has commanded that those who preach the gospel should earn their living by the gospel". The congregation should do their utmost to support the pastor and other financial obligations. What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? They will be judged accordingly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Posted May 18, 2014 Report Share Posted May 18, 2014 I Corinthians 9:13-14: In supporting the ministry Jesus ordered that those who benefited from preachers should help in supporting them. Thus enabling them to focus on the gospel ministry. A few scriptures that support this principle are: Matthew 10:9-10; Luke 10:7; Leviticus 27:30-32; and most of I Corinthians 9. There are many more. Church support of focused preachers and pastors is critical to the world-wide gospel ministry. Men and women of God who follow their calling and give their lives and vocations to Christ to spread and grow Christianity and the Christian community should be supported as directed by scripture and God will hold individual Christians as well the church accountable as in everything else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guitar Jim Posted May 21, 2014 Report Share Posted May 21, 2014 Q2. (1 Corinthians 9:13-14) Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? Jesus said that a worker is entitled to his pay. It's that simple. That should be applied across the board in life as well as in Christian service. We see in the world today millions of workers getting paid not enough to live on! And that's seen as OK by governments and employers the world over. I reckon it's disgraceful. What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor – and, if possible, other workers? Way back in the Old Testament provision was made in the Law of Moses for those doing God's work to receive support. The tithe was to support the tribe of Levi which was the tribe in charge of worship in the tent and later the temple. "Do not muzzle an ox when you use it to thrash corn" is a command, not a suggestion. What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? Jesus told an interesting parable which concluded with: "Whatever you do for the least of my followers, you do to ME!!" The stingy board members may have to wait till judgement day to give an account, but give it they will. Hmm that reads like Yoda wrote it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haar Posted May 27, 2014 Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 Q2. (1 Corinthians 9:13-14) Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor -- and, if possible, other workers? What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? Jesus commanded his disciples to receive support on their journey because the labourer deserved his wages. Christian congregations have the obligation to support their pastor and other Church workers because it is an instruction by both the Lord Jesus and Paul. Th Church board members who then knowing this obligation but under pay their Pastor will account for this before God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dixonle Posted June 30, 2014 Report Share Posted June 30, 2014 Q2. (1 Corinthians 9:13-14) Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor – and, if possible, other workers? What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? According to our notes, there is historical precedent for this idea of clergy support in that God provided the priests a continual share of the sacrifices offered by the people to God which was a portion of their tithes. So the priests were able to receive in direct proportion to that which was given. There are scriptural references to this not only in the Old Testament but the New as well...Dr. Wilson quotes Matthew 10.9-10 that "the worker is worth his keep" and Luke 10.7 that "the worker deserves his wages". These were not suggestions but commands of the LORD. The boards and members of local churches have the responsibility/command of tithing and if the funds are not at the level needed, then the pastor will consequently receive less support and therefore the church would not be abiding by the commands of our LORD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blezed Posted August 3, 2014 Report Share Posted August 3, 2014 Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? 1. Because they were worth his keep and deserved wages. What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor – and, if possible, other workers? 2. The Lord has commanded that those who preach the gospel should receive their living from the gospel. What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? 3. They will be held accountable on judgment day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blezed Posted August 3, 2014 Report Share Posted August 3, 2014 Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? 1. Because they were worth his keep and deserved wages. What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor – and, if possible, other workers? 2. The Lord has commanded that those who preach the gospel should receive their living from the gospel. What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? 3. They will be held accountable on judgment day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoanG Posted June 25, 2015 Report Share Posted June 25, 2015 Jesus did not want his disciples to have to take time from their teaching of the word of Christ to find a way to support themselves. He wanted them to spend each possible moment on the work of God. Christian Congregations are to make sure that the pastor is well taken care of. They are to support those that do the work of God. The pastor that serves them should not have to do another job to support themselves. I feel that the board members will be judged more harshly if they withheld payments to pastors when the money is clearly at hand. They would be punished just as the servants with the talents were put to shame for not growing their talents but by burying them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irmela Posted June 4, 2022 Report Share Posted June 4, 2022 Q2. (1 Corinthians 9:13-14) Why did Jesus command his disciples to receive support on their journeys? What scriptural obligation do Christian congregations have to do their best to support their pastor -- and, if possible, other workers? What accountability will church board members experience when they pay their pastor less than they should? The disciples were not doing other work to get wages to support themselves. They were sent out by Jesus to preach, saying the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand; cure the sick; raise the dead; cleanse the lepers; drive out demons. (Matthew 10: 7&8) This was their work. The workman deserves his support - his living, his food. (Matthew 10:10) The pastor, who is working in the vineyard (congregation) designated to him, and the workers with him should also receive support. Deut 25:4 You shall not muzzle the ox when he treads out the grain. That is to say the labourer is worthy of his hire. Malachi 3:12 Bring the tithes to the storehouse so that there is food in My House. Who is working there to benefit from that? The pastors and the other full time workers. Lev 27:30-32 Again we see be it seeds, fruit, herds, flocks etc., the tithe belongs to the Lord Numb 18:21-28 Here we see how the Levites were cared for and supported by the tithes brought in. The obligation that was given to the Israelites as a nation to support the Levites consecrated to being in the service of the Lord, is now given to the congregations to support the pastors, missionaries, evangelists etc working under that specific umbrella. The board members are held accountable before God to pay the pastors their due. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krissi Posted July 9, 2023 Report Share Posted July 9, 2023 God promises to meet our needs. We must look to Him for provision, not toward other believers. Though God can choose to provide through believers, He can choose also to meet the need directly by feeding manna or sending ravens with food. When God lays it on our hearts to give, we must obey promptly and generously. But when we are the one in need, we should never turn to others but privately ask God Himself to meet our need. Obey God and He will provide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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