Pastor Ralph Posted July 2, 2004 Report Share Posted July 2, 2004 Q3. (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? Why or why not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lora Posted July 17, 2004 Report Share Posted July 17, 2004 Q3. (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? Agape love is love regardless to whom it is given. I can't see it being easier than loving church members. Either you love with Agape love or you don't. It does not single out certain people; and if we single out church members then we are not walking in Agape love. God has no respect of persons. So if we are loving with God's love then we love everybody, even those who are unlovable, those who cause you to want to go the other way. But God reminds us of the fact that we are a product, a image of Him. If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? Why or why not? No we can not mature fully in Christ because sometimes God will allow church members to bring out of us what needs to come out. If we can't tend to horses in our own home, then how can we in the house of God, so my point is if we can deal with the hurts from family members then we should be able to let God have His way with us in the church with His members, or should I say His body because He is the aurthor and the finisher of our faith. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccs Posted July 18, 2004 Report Share Posted July 18, 2004 Q3. (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? Why or why not? Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? Because we think others should be at the same level of Christian maturity as we are. We gift project thinking they should know and grow and be as we are. But agape love is love which gives without thought of what it will get back. My children taught me this lesson, and don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
June Posted July 19, 2004 Report Share Posted July 19, 2004 AGAPE LOVE MEANS LOVING YOUR ENEMIES AND PRAYING FOR THOSE THAT PERSECUTE YOU. AGAPE LOVE GIVES WITHOUT THOUGHT OF WHAT YOU WILL GET BACK. BEING CALLED TO SOMETHING HIGHER THAN THAT WHICH WILL BENEFIT US. I THINK OF 1 COR. 13 ( THE LOVE CHAPTER) WHENEVER I HEAR OF AGAPE LOVE. LOVE IS PATIENT, IS KIND, DOES NOT ENVY, DOES NOT BOAST, IS NOT PROUD, IS NOT RUDE, IS NOT SELF-SEEKING, IS NOT EASILY ANGERED, AND KEEPS NO RECORD OF WRONGS. LOVE NEVER FAILS! WE WILL NOT MATURE TO THE HEIGHTS THAT CHRIST WANTS US TO IF WE HOLD AN AUGHT AGAINST ANYONE. GO TO THEM AND ASK FORGIVENESS AND GET IT STRAIGHTENED OUT AND MOVE ON TO GREATER HEIGHTS WITH CHRIST. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunilbernard Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 Q3. (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? Why or why not? Agape love is something out of the ordinary. It is not done regularly. It is divine. It is uncommon. We imagine that because we are Christians, we love with Jesus' love. We love in general, all the christian community. But this is far from the truth. We hate certain obnoxious characters in the church who are so loud mouthed, character assassins, etc...but Jesus said the sick person needs the physician. How true it is. The obnoxious person in the church needs love more than the goody goody character. It is easy to deal in general terms but hard to deal in specifics. Herein lies the test. We should surrender ourself completely to the Holy Spirit so that He will develop our character to love in 'agape fashion' We cannot mature as Christians if we avoid church because of certain obnoxious persons. No one is perfect and no church is perfect. All of us live together as a body of believers to help each other grow spiritually. Living alone will hamper growth. We need the singer, the preacher, the attender, the steward etc... for our spiritual growth. Each one contributes his/her mite so that the other one is benifited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helen Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 I guess we think of God's love as a wonderful experience which we equate to agape love. However, experiencing that love is not entering into the practice of it. That takes the power of God and the gentle correction of His Spirit. We are made the sons of God through the blood of Jesus. His divine power has given us all that pertains to Life and godliness. We are to use this magnificent gift, and to build a loving heart as described in 1 Cor 13. A heart like the heart of God loves under all conditions, even conditions of personal hurt. Jesus said "Father, forgive them for they know not what to do", and we are to love people even in their ignorance of what they do, who they hurt etc. We are to pray for those who despitefullly use us, and do good to those who mistreat us. This is to have the mind of Christ, or in old testament terms, like King David, to have a heart after God's own heart, forgiving and perpetually loving. This is not easy or "natural" to us. We need to desire to love like this, and to ask Father in Jesus' Name to help us do it. We need to use the shield of faith to deflect personal fiery darts, and not receive them, or respond to them in any way, seeking only the good of the one who fires them! We need to have a vision of living for love, and not for self. And just when you think you have it licked, something will happen that sends you straight back to God, asking again for the power to love. After having been able to use the shield of faith reasonably well, I found this week that I needed again to ask Father again for the power to forgive and to love. He did just that! How mighty and faithful is our God! This said, there is no possibility that we would not come to church because someone said the wrong thing, or may not say the right thing. There is only the possibility that we will love them whatever they say or said, by the grace of Almighty God. We come to church to worship and adore our beloved Jesus. That has nothing to do with anyone else. If we put Him first, He will help us get our relationships right with every person. That is the order! In fact we are to do that before we consider taking communion, lest we drink damnation to ourselves. Our God is a god of reconciliation. Let us fear God, and love one another at all costs! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annielou Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 If we are hurt by someone the Word tells us to go and make that right. If we avoid them by missing church then we are only delaying what God wants to do through us and we are hurting ourselves. A reconciliation cannot take place if we avoid confrontation. And if we are not seeking reconciliation then we are putting ourselves outside of God's will. Maturity comes when we exercise our faith and seek to do God's will and not what just makes us comfortable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patricia Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 Every trial and every hurt actually becomes a blessing...a new opportunity to grow into that unmoveable love....a new chance to pray for and love our enemies. By practicing this, we finaly are set free of grudges and strife. We are at peace with all around us and we can look at every trial as "What is is that God is trying to teach me with this problem?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 I have never imagined agape love being easier then loving church members and now that I have meditated on it I still can not imagine this. If we avoid church because of hurts and do not forgive these church members and we do not seek other Christians we will not mature fully for we will not be united, joined together in the faith and knowledge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhondak30 Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 Q3. (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? We recently were exhorted to not see agape love as impossible by our minister of christian education. I do not see any love being possible outside of Jesus Christ. God is love. Inorder to love our knowledge of the love of God affords the hope that we too can love as God loves when we trust the love that God shows us enough to demonstrate that same kind of love toward others with the help of the Holy Spirit. Loving fellow christians is not a seperate category for me. Loving fallen mankind beginning with myself is what I believe the second of the greatest commands denotes. Love your neighbor as yourself. When I don't love myself, I can not love my neighbor. If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? Why or why not? If we avoid church, period. We can not mature. I believe that God instituted the Church. He is coming back for the church. He expects believer to be equiped in the church inorder to complete the great commission given to the disciples. It is not easy loving people, but with God all things are possible. He would not have asked us to do what He would not equip us to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randy777 Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 It is not hard for me to love others and I am thrilled when I see a member of the congregation I belong to but occasionally there are those with whom I miss a connection even though I believe them to be solid parts of the body I just find it difficult to fellowship with them. I think this is a type of elitism on my part in that for the most part I want them to think more highly of me but they are doing and thinking other things so when I having spent a lot of time talking to others or studying and talking to God on a particular matter voice some things they are not understanding me because that is not what they are about. To make this clearer let me say that I am not involved with any ministry on a regular basis at my church except for Sunday School and Church attendance and fellowships and Wednesday night but family work schedules have made that difficult lately. I volonteer in a support role for a career decisions workshop that meets at another local church and my career is based on the ministry of bringing growth through stability to the individuals, families, neighborhoods, and churches in the area. I have a lighthouse ministry of prayer which is not very active right now because it is so hot outside. There is a third ministry I believe needs to begin and I see some small growth as I continue to pray and mention it to others. Our church is growing and I and my family have been blessed to be a part of that on an ongoing and regular basis just not in one ministry over a long period of time. I am very uncomfortable in my church though mainly because I am not socially or economically like many of the members. Most folks such as myself do end up leaving the church with complaints that I could share as valid complaints but cannot share as reasons for leaving. There is a verse about not being offended when others do us wrong and for the most part those who do offend me do not mean to or even understand me enough to know if they have offended me but basically I just have to turn and not even look as far as the cross but just look at Christ and the disciples or Paul to see that they had similar difficulties in what they ate, wore, how they partied or worshipped so we just need to find ways to love each other better and know each other better. My first study with Pastor Ralph I was close to homebound and became even more homebound later but now I can get out and about pretty good but my health is not pefect so this contributes a lot to my not finding a regular ministry at my church but perhaps God has something else in mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jesus4al Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 Q3. (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? Why or why not? Personally, I don't believe that loving God is easier than loving others. But, my definition of 'love' might be different than yours. Brotherly kindness, charity, and love; this is the subject. To 'avoid' trials and tribulations is not a Christ like attitude, to me. I pray for a Christlike attitude for all of us, in The Family of God. Love ...Bro. Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kayakchick Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 Q3. (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? Why or why not?I see the problem as we decide that we "philio" our fellow brothers and sisters and not "agape" them. It's like Peter and Christ's conversation when Christ asked Peter "Do you agape me?" and Peter responded "Yes, Lord, I philio you." We've got to be at the point where we agape each other as fellow believers since we are called to do this. We cannot mature fully in Christ without the agape. We will always be stunted as mature christians without agape. How can we fully experience the deep love of God without understanding the true meaning of agape? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helen Spaulding Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 Q3. (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? Why or why not? Agape love sounds innoucous--just love all children of God! In the plural. undifferentiated. not individually. Church members can sometimes be less than Christian ideals--including myself. But, we have to forgive those who hurt us--intentionally or not--before we can truly love them. Avoid church? If we do, we cannot truly follow Him. He said "Do good to those who persecute you!" Not just minor bumps--PERSECUTE you! Only a person who is mature (or at least striving to become so) can truly forgive another--even those they realize did not do it intentionally, let alone those who intended the abuse. If we avoid church because of this, we keep ourselves outside of the will of God. Without His Spirit within us, we will fall short of His desires for us. We need hearing the Word and studying what He wants of us--daily, yes, but even more so in the body of Christ--His Church--every Sunday, in order to be open to His guidance and help in forgiveness as well as in all other areas of growing more like Him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cindybear Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 When we avoid church because of our hurt over what our brothers and sisters in Christ have done to us, we don't really understand the nature of agap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyBeloved Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 Agape love is easier than loving church members because church members are human as we are. None of us are perfect in any way and we all have flaws which makes it more difficult to love one another. If a brother or sister hurts us we need to pray for that person and GOD will put a love and concern in our hearts for them. How can we hate one for whom we are praying? If we stay away from fellow believers we will not grow in the LORD. He tells us in His Word to meet together and we need to obey Him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Nabors Posted July 21, 2004 Report Share Posted July 21, 2004 Q3. (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? Why or why not? We tend to hold church members to a higher standard than people who don't attend church. There is nothing wrong with this. However, we are less forgiving when church members stumble. We mistakenly expect fellowship with church members to always result in nothing but uplifting and happy ends. So, when that doesn't occur or we see or hear of church members acting hypocritical we are offended. I'm afraid this happens out of selfishness. It is harder to mature fully in Christ without being around other believers and learning from them. Most believers attend a Christian church because the church is the body of Christ by definition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt_Z_Squad Posted July 21, 2004 Report Share Posted July 21, 2004 3a.) (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? 3a.) I guess because it is in our imagination. Again "agape" love is the last of the traits Peter tells us to attain. I think this is the most difficult. If you are not loving church members, there is no "agape" love. 3b.) (2 Peter 1:7) If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? 3b.) No. Many have already given the Scripture references..in particular I point to Hebrews 10:25. One other Scripture reference is Matthew 5:23-24; Jesus tells us to: "Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your borther has something against you, leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to your brother; then come and offer your gift." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grace Posted July 21, 2004 Report Share Posted July 21, 2004 I think that member(Sunnilbernard) has answered that question properly,as to Agape Love. This is really the love that only God can express ,even though as we grow in Jesus , we can show a God-like love, but we are still operating in the flesh, and having the same contention with sin, as expressed by Paul, who struggled with doing the right thing (Rom.8). Avoiding church is NEVER the answer. This will let a matter go unresolved between the two parties. God instructs us to pray for those who have offended us. It's to be remembered that we are all vital to the Body of Christ no matter how we see each other in the body. God has placed that member in the body AS IT HAS PLEASED HIM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Ross Posted July 21, 2004 Report Share Posted July 21, 2004 As a group, fellow church members can be very trying. Certain members want the floor too often. Some are cronic complainers. Some come with hygiene problems. The list goes on-But we have been told that we are to give these people, and all of the body of Christ our unconditional love. In our spiritual walk, to become more godly, we must look beyond the obvious when dealing with church members, and deal with them as we ask God to deal with us. We need the church members in our lives, even when they may cause us to hurt. It is for us to love and support them-" ..in as much as you have done it to one of the least of these, my brethren, you have done it unto me." Matt 25:40. To mature in Christ, we must become good stewards for our church members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinclair Posted July 21, 2004 Report Share Posted July 21, 2004 Q3. (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? Why or why not? Agape is loving church members unconditionally. When God's imparts His Agape love to the Christian they will look at and treat church members different. The old nature tell us not to forgive and to hold onto a grudge. Jesus gave us in Matthew 5: 43-48 these conditions for loving church members. If we always have the other person best interest at heart we will not find ourselves hating or avoiding any brother or sister in Chirst. The sinfulful nature tells us not to forgive and to hold grudges, but Jesus tells us to model after Him and walk in Hiis ways. If we avoid church because someone had brused us or rob us the wrong way we will never mature unless we deal with the hurts and forgive the person who wronged us. It takes a mature Christian to go to the other church member and tell them how they have hurt you and in agape love make matters right and move on in the faith. As Jesus said in the model prayer in Luke 11: 4-5 we must forgive if we expect God to forgive us our wrong doings. If we have goodness, knowledge, self-control, perseverence, goliness, brotherly kindness but no agape love I Coninthians 13 it will not do us any good because God is not in control of our actions. God's kind of love is directed outward not inward toward ourselves. It is uncondition love that leads to maturity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kim E. Posted July 21, 2004 Report Share Posted July 21, 2004 This question reminds me of how a person might feel if they are outside the church. From personal experience I know that some people feel that they Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linda Stanley Posted July 21, 2004 Report Share Posted July 21, 2004 Q3. (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? Why or why not? "Agape Love" is a love that is unconditional.This is a very special kind of love.A love that is given without any thought of anything given in return.Jesus has "Agape Love".He gave "Agape Love".If we are to be Christ like we must have that special love also.We should love our church brother's and sister's.Our churches are not perfect.Our churches are made from the people,which are human who have diffrent views or have their own standards of what they think church members should be like. Every person who comes through your church doors needs love.Love covers it all.We are not perfect.We can learn from each other,help each other.We do not put each other down because of the hurts of church members and then stop coming to church.We . build each other up.Unity also helps us mature fully in Christ.We need each other.We pray for each other,worship together,.Jesus Christ is our foundation,and Jesus gave a love beyond any words that could be said."He gave His life.A very hard pattern of love ~~"AgapeLove"~~to try and follow.With that kind of love in mind we will grow in all the virtues of Jesus Christ. I hope this does not sound like I am criticizing or fault finding in our churches I didnt mean it in that way.I confess my ownself needs more love and brotherly kindness of love to my brother's and sisters's in Christ.I love you all.Blessings Linda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norree Posted July 21, 2004 Report Share Posted July 21, 2004 I had a friend who I had a disagreement with and she stoped going to the church and quit the bible study through the church as well. If people stop going to a church, especially one as large as the one I attend, because of a conflict with a brother or sister, the maybe they should question why they were going to church in the first place, I am ther first and foremost to worship and study the Word. People are always going to be difficult to get along with, this side of Heaven. We cannot place so much emphasis on emotional things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatrickWong_sg Posted July 22, 2004 Report Share Posted July 22, 2004 Q3. (2 Peter 1:7) Why do we imagine that "agape love" is easier than loving church members? If we avoid church because of our hurts at the hands of church members, can we mature fully in Christ? Why or why not? I do not think that the bible speaks about shades of love. Love is love, if there are any shades it is our own interpretation. Being hurts and wrong is not that uncommon. Wasn't Jesus being hurt all the time by the very people that he is trying to reach out to. I guess that if I want to take exception to every incident that happened whether inside or outside of church then I don't think I will ever be able to continue to maintain my faith in Christ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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