house Posted October 3, 2008 Report Share Posted October 3, 2008 whose death/actual or figurative? Christ's death Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
June Posted October 4, 2008 Report Share Posted October 4, 2008 Paul is talking about the actual death of Christ. When we get baptized we are saying that we accept Christ and His ways for our lives. We unite as one in Him, both in death & resurrection. It is reality and without the faith our spiritual being is deprived. We must put on our spiritual being rather than physical being and unite to see Christin the spiritual realm.What a glorious reunion that will be when we meet Jesus face to face! The only way for that to happen is to believe & accept Christ as the ONLY way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulcrf Posted October 6, 2008 Report Share Posted October 6, 2008 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Answer: Paul means " death to sin" as putting off our sinful nature or burying with Christ through baptism. Knowing that our old self was crucified with Christ, our new life is freed from sin. Whose death is he talking about? Answer: Death to our old sinful life. How does this death become our own? Answer: By being united with Christ in His death. To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? Answer: The death of our sinful nature being united with the death of Christ on the Cross can be real when we accept the fact that Christ died for our sins. Instead of us suffering for our sins, Christ bear the consequences of it. Our role is to accept his death for our death by changing our old sinful life with a life with Christ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah43 Posted October 6, 2008 Report Share Posted October 6, 2008 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? Paul is referring to both an historical, actual death (the Christ's) as well as a figurative death (ours, in that we have died and are born again in Christ). Paul is also pointing a finger beyond the temporal towards everlasting life. Christ is at once deity and everyman. I am inspired by these verses to turn to John 14:19, 20 wherein the Christ says of his impending death and its spiritual import to hose baptized," Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more, but ye see me, because I live, ye shall live also. At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you." Somehow, because of his incarnation and crucifixion, and our belief in Him and who He was/is, He assimilates believers into himself and into the Father. Thus His death is His own, but ours as well, in both a figurative and literal sense, re-enacting constantly on earth for us, for each of us as we are baptized, born again, and die. To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? If we have faith in Christ and in the Father, and believe in the Holy Spirit, this is about as real as it gets. To the non-believer, it is "theological mumbo-jumbo." See John 14:17 "Even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eudora Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Both. Figuratively, it is a symbol to us of what happens when we die, but in reality, we daily die until we die in the actual. If we do not daily die to sin, it is all a bunch of hooey. We are changed in an instant, tis true, but still, we grow more and more like Christ, in His image, daily. Sin speaks a dead language that means nothing to us; God speaks our mother tongue, and we hang on every word. We are dead to sin and alive to God. That's what Jesus did for all of us.. It is kinda like a circumcision. A little bit by a little bit is cut away and that is old dead skin, the old me what used to be life. Now, it is peeled away, layer by layer as we take on the image of Christ. A new creature evolves over time. Whose death is he talking about? The death of the old self, the one who sinned and was locked into a certain death of sin. How does this death become our own? We give it up to live with Jesus and live a new life in Him, by His spirit, with in us. We literally give up the life that we have when we meet Him at the cross. To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? This is and never will be mumbo jumbo to those who have their hope in Christ. It is Christ in me, the hope of Glory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
open2itall Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Paul is (I think) referring to an actual death. Whose death is he talking about? Jesus Christ How does this death become our own? By surrendering our old-self to Christ, dieing to self, and living in Him (and this is symbolised by baptism) To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? We are transformed in a very real way. The cause that prevents is removed, namely guilt. This happens instantly. And then by reaching out to God who is always there for us in the form of Jesus Christ the transformation continues, and the more we expect from Christ, the more we receive from Him: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosie1Rose Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? Before I became a Christian, I was spiritually dead to God and alive to sin. I accepted Christ as my Saviour and changed sides. In baptism, symbolically, as I went under the water,my spiritually dead to God and alive to sin self was crucified, as Jesus was on the Cross. When I arose from the water, as Jesus arose from the dead, I left my old self in the water and was 'resurrected' as a new, alive to God, holy person. It is not mumbo-jumbo, but a physical symbol of Jesus death and resurrection on the Cross, helping those of us not at Calvary to understand Calvary, and those of us newly joined to Christ to become joined to Him. It is real, precious and now I understand how my old sin self is dead. Thank you Pastor Ralph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCHRIS Posted October 13, 2008 Report Share Posted October 13, 2008 Paul then says that since Christ died to sin, and now lives to God, so we are counted the same. That is, as He died once to sin and lives to God, we must reckon we are as Him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revjarden1 Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 The death that Paul is referring to is the Death of the old self, the person we were before we were crucified with Christ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
servant for Christ Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? Paul is referring to a figurative death. It is our death he is talking about. This death becomes our's when a true believer is identified by his death to sin. We have been translated from the realm of sin into the realm of life with Christ. We as believers will have a definite separation from sin. We will not want to sin. It is reality becauuse God is real, Jesus Christ is real, the Holy Spirit is real, and He lives in us to guide and teach us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emmaus Posted October 25, 2008 Report Share Posted October 25, 2008 I'm not sure I understand that Paul is saying here but I believe he is talking about Christ's death on the cross. It becomes our own when we are baptized. We die and are born again. It's real but I think it's a spiritaul death and rebirth. We make a public demonstration, through faith, of joining Christ in His death and resurrection when we are baptized. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted October 25, 2008 Report Share Posted October 25, 2008 I think that Paul is referring to a figurative 'death' to sin. During baptism we are joined with Christ, in His death. Not our death, but His. Somehow, we become fused together with Christ and His predominant goodness and purity kind of leads us into the same goodness and purity. I think it is the beginning or our sin life being put to death. It is done - but we have to live it out. All our past sin is forgiven and forgotten, but there is still sin in our lives, which we have also to die to. I don't think I have expressed it very well, I hope you know what I mean. Love Greta Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snaps Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? I am thinking he is referring to a relative death. Jesus plants the seed of LIFE in us when we accept Him. Baptism is the outward sign of that acceptance. That seed is larger than the seed of death (acceptance of a lie) accepted by Adam. The new seed is capable of overcoming all that Adam's seed set in train. More and more we shall be able to operate in the power of the new seed of LIFE if we so choose. We can never again be the same as we were before we accepted this seed, although we can cease from operating in its power. We'll be accountable for that! Paul is saying we need to operate as those who have received this new seed, in all its potential (fruits of the spirit, giftings of prophecy, tongues, teaching, evangelism and apostleship sometimes) and above all, love. This seed can over-ride the seeds of death for eternity Whose death is he talking about? It is our death to the old nature that becomes possible with the new seed of LIFE sown in us through Jesus' sacrifice at Calvary. If we nurture this seed it grows into a mighty tree of LIFE that survives into eternity. Not nurtured it can be lost again and the soul inured to LIFE. Eg Jesus said some seed falls on fertile ground, some on stony, some among weeds and some on shallow soil. When it falls on fertile ground it grows into a tree of LIFE. This death becomes our own when we choose to nurture the seed of LIFE Jesus sowed in us, making us increasingly oblivious to the effects and nature of the Adam seed of death. This is no mumbo-jumbo. It is how it works in my life. When I nurture the seeds of LIFE by Bible reading, prayer, worship etc I am a completely different person than I have been when I have neglected this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starangel2 Posted December 31, 2008 Report Share Posted December 31, 2008 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? I think Paul is talking about our death to sin is our changing desires. We no longer want to sin and recoginze that some of the things that we haved done are sinful. We now want to be righteous in Christ and fellowship with the Christ and the Holy Spirit. He's talking about our new changed desires and teh death of our old desires. It becomes our own when we accept Jesus and are filled with the Holy Spirit. It is real. My desires changed when I became a Christian. I now love to go to church and read my Bible and fellowship with the saints. Off with the old and on with the New. Happy New Year in Jesus everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelOnLine Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Paul is referring to our figurative death to sin. Whose death is he talking about? The death of Christ How does this death become our own? In faith and baptism we became connected to Christ's own death entered into for the purpose of crushing sin and bringing atonement in the cross. To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? It has a basis in reality because we have faith that Christ did die for our sins. We are forgiven. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron2 Posted January 10, 2009 Report Share Posted January 10, 2009 To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? I don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsG Posted January 29, 2009 Report Share Posted January 29, 2009 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality We have freedom now because of Jesus' death over sins hold on us. We are now united in Christ Jesus through His death and resurrection on the cross. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karyann Posted February 28, 2009 Report Share Posted February 28, 2009 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? Rom 6:1 What should we say, then? Should we go on sinning so that grace may increase? Rom 6:2 Of course not! How can we who died as far as sin is concerned go on living in it? Rom 6:3 Or don't you know that all of us who were baptized into union with Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? Rom 6:4 Therefore, through baptism we were buried with him into his death so that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the Father's glory, we too may live an entirely new life. Rom 6:5 For if we have become united with him in a death like his, we will certainly also be united with him in a resurrection like his. Rom 6:6 We know that our old selves were crucified with him so that our sinful bodies might be rendered powerless and we might no longer be slaves to sin. Rom 6:7 For the person who has died has been freed from sin. Paul is referring to historical death.He is talking about Jesus's death.It becomes our own death because when Jesus died we died with him to get a new life.It has basis in reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurselaino Posted March 2, 2009 Report Share Posted March 2, 2009 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? Rom 6:1 What should we say? Should we keep on sinning, so that God's wonderful kindness will show up even better? Rom 6:2 No, we should not! If we are dead to sin, how can we go on sinning? Rom 6:3 Don't you know that all who share in Christ Jesus by being baptized also share in his death? Rom 6:4 When we were baptized, we died and were buried with Christ. We were baptized, so that we would live a new life, as Christ was raised to life by the glory of God the Father. Rom 6:5 If we shared in Jesus' death by being baptized, we will be raised to life with him. Rom 6:6 We know that the persons we used to be were nailed to the cross with Jesus. This was done, so that our sinful bodies would no longer be the slaves of sin. Rom 6:7 We know that sin doesn't have power over dead people. Here Paul is talking about an actual Historical event. The crucifixion and death of Jesus Christ is the death he is referring to. When we accept Jesus as our saviour we are also united with Him in His death but even more than that we are united with Him in His resurrection. To believers this is no mumbo-jumbo. Christ did die and He did rise to life after death beating sin and death but we are also warned that this will be hidden from those who do not believe making it impossible for them to understand therefore for unbelievers it is simply foolishness and until their eyes are opened and they are no longer walk in darkness it will continue to be that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catldog Posted March 6, 2009 Report Share Posted March 6, 2009 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? It's a historical death to sin because Christ actually did die and with him we died. Since we are united to christ and he died so that death is now considered our own. It's not theological mumbo-jumbo but some may not see it that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one little branch Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? I had to think twice on this one. The answer to this can be life-changing. Paul is referring to the historical physical death of Christ and to our being "baptixed" or united, grafted in, incorporated into Christ so that what happened to Him it happened to me. When Paul says "I have been crucified with Christ and I no longe live but Christ lives in me..." he was referring to this fact. We died to our old ways and old man behavior and we are a totally a new creation..."behold the old has gone and the new has come". Paul is referring to Christ death and us being buried with Him. The fact that this took place in the spiritual realm does not make it less real. We are to live the Christ life simply because by faith all of this too\k place when we believe and is taking place even now as the power of the Holy Spirit continues His sanctifying work in us. To walk daily in this reality is to grasp the notion that we are indeed inhabited by the Holy Spirit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patricia A Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? The death of Jesus was a actual historical event. We unite with Christ's death in a spiritual way so that we die to the sinful life. This is real--not just some unrealistic chatter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosie1Rose Posted July 25, 2009 Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? Paul is referring to an actual spiritual death - the death of our old selves and the recreation of our new selves. In some way I don't fully understand, in baptism spiritually I join Christ on the cross, I die with Him, am resurrected with Him and will reign with Him in Heaven. I cannot see how it can be theological mumbo-jumbo when I see the reality in my life. I do not need to know how it works, to know that it does. It's like I was asleep but am now awake, was dead but am now more fully alive than I have ever been. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C Riv Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Q3. (Romans 6:1-7) Is Paul referring to a figurative "death" to sin, or to a kind of historical, actual death? Whose death is he talking about? How does this death become our own? To what degree is this just theological mumbo-jumbo or does it have some basis in reality? Well I read that Paul is talking a figurative death to us, the death of our old ways, to sin, but of Christ death is actual and historical. The death is of Jesus and it becomes our own when we take those steps to baptism because we are surrendering ourselves to Him. Coming alive in Christ and dead to our sinful ways. I do not believe this is theological mumbo jumbo, I believe these are words inspired by the Holy Spirit thru Paul given to us to read, study and meditate on. Reality is Jesus died for all, we who turn to follow do give up our ways to Him and our sins are washed away forever. We do have a new life style to live out as we follow our Leader. We are truly blessed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionbait Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 Paul is making reference to or old man being dead, that we have died with Christ when we accepted Him as Our Saviour and through baptisim we walk in the newess of the new man. But we try so hard not to sin to walk in the new man but thankfully when we do slip He is there for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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