Q3. Preventing Power-Mongering

[steve.c]

How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

This is a very difficult question. In chosing your elders or your pastor, you are chosing someone in a leadership position; this always has the potential for abuse. Obviously the interview and reference process must be as thorough as possible so that as that as far as possible a candidate can be selected, who will serve the congregation with love a humility as did Jesus. We must be sure that any appointment is of someone whose beliefs and teaching are based entirely on the Word of God so that the community will be guided in truth as our Lord insists. But, as Pastor Ralph observes, power has a tendancy to corrupt. People change when they are put into positions of authority in a manner that no interviewing process can anticipate. The selection must be handled as diligently and as impartially as possible but, above all, we must ask for God's help in our judgement and I am sure He will give it. Together we must pray earnestly for guidance in our choice and pray that our choice extends Christ's church in our community and beyond. Once a selection s been made, we must be as supportive of the new appointment as we can and pray together. A united, cooperative Christian community is less likely to fall into the sin of dissention which so often accompanies, or precedes, those in authority throwing their weight around.

[L. Turner]

We should always seek God in whatever we do, but especially when we are chooing our leaders. Our leaders should be men and woman after God's own heart. Jesus should be the example that they are seeking after, not power. Jesus was the Son of God and He was humble even to the point of death. He did not see anything wrong with washing the disciples' feet.

He should be the example that we look at when choosing our leaders, then we will have to be concerned with whether or not the man or woman of God will become a power-monger.

[Craig]

If members of any given congregration got involved in the life of and work of the church, most often you would not have elders or the pastor lording it over the church. Often, the elders, pastor and/or small group within the church are doing the work and assuming control and power as a result. Wide-spread apathy often drops power into the laps of whose who really weren't looking for it, but they have it and eventually use it and grow acustom to it. Which causes a problem. Additionally, a congregation can limit leadership in their By-laws.

Pray for church leadership and get involved, that takes care of most contol issues.

[Robin D]

I believe the church should pray that God will send the right leader for the needs of the church. If the pastor is called by God, and put in the leadership position for a church, there shouldn't be authority issues. The pastor is tried before bestowing authoriy through an ordination process. The Bible gives us specific guidelines on the qualifications of a pastor. The danger is in not following God's word.

[Tabatha]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

Christ wants these Elders, or Shepards or overseers being utilized in different ways to understand regarding the attitude as Servants in the Body of Christ.

Peter tells these Elders to serve, " not because you must, but because you are willing, as God wants you to be; not greedy for money, but eager to serve; " Lot of guys get pushed into these types of leadership roles and unfortunately it becomes, not a labor of love, but plain laborious.

Peter tells us that this should be something that you are called to by God which will show itself in a willingness to serve, not under compulsion. Evidently in Peter's day there were guys who felt this was simply a good career move and so they entered into service with motives that were not pure.

And so he adds that you shouldn't be greedy for money. The idea here in the Greek is that one should not use the office of Elder or Pastor to acuire dishonest gain. And it would be dishonest to use the office as anything other than serve Christ as you serve the Body with the idea of equipping the saints to grow in their salvation.

If your motivation is simply to become a professional Pastor, ( Hireling ) with all of the perqs. you deem essential for furthering your career, Then God is not pleased and the Body is not served.

Paul really hits the nail on the head when he defines this attitude in ( 1st Tim. 3:3 ) in describing the qualifications of an Elder or Overseer. He must be " free from the love of money. "

Neither Peter or Paul deny money isn't important to enable the Elder, who is Pastoring a church, to continue to minister as he has needs, but the attitude is what both men are addressing when it comes to money. You can't serve two masters and as an Elder or Paster, you have only one Master who has placed you over His flock for one purpose; to Shepard, which involves leading, feeding and protecting and it should be done with an eagerness to please Jesus.

If one is following the lead of the Chief Shepard, Jesus Christ, then he will do it in a way that emulates the Master. And so Peter continues in ( verse 3 ) " not lording it over those intrusted to you, but being examples to the flock.

The isea of lording is to try and control, for your own purposes, and set up a little kingdom on earth to draw attention to yourself while using others in the process. Now, evidently Peter believed that there was a real danger of this type of thing happening.

In fact, we know that Paul had run into it on various occasions; people who want to feel important and puff themselves up with the idea of lording over others with the authority they feel they have

There's often lots of talk going on in leadership circles which tends to sound lofty and godly and biblical, but when you take away the veneer it's meaningless and self-serving and full of fluff; no substance

That can be real danger. We've all heard the expression, " power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely." Peter understood this and he was warning that if someone is assuming leadership and only doing it for the sake of power and authority then it's in the flesh. The flesh will always move in that direction of abusing power and authority.

Leaders should always be able to be seen in a way where others can say that's how I want to live out my life to Christ's glory. Leaders shouldn't limit their example to when they are seen. They should also practice godliness when no one but God can see them. This should'nt be limited to just leaders,

The Chief Shepherd is coming back to take us to Himself and every leader who has served will be able to stand before his King and be honored by Christ Himself as a faithful servant in the capacity to which he was called.

[John Weir]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

http://www.joyfulheart.com/forums/index.ph...;f=42&t=187

It is so easy to find oneself developing into a position of power and lording it over others. To avoid this it is essential to 'serve' others humbly. This is achieved by being responsible for a section or group within the body of believers. Decision making is by consensus and democratically taken by all concerned. However this often drags out the process and this is the danger.

Testing a person is a good idea but can be difficult if there is no one else to serve in a particular position. Clear guidelines for the positions are the only way to deal with the problem.

[Mrstoler]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

I am not sure how to keep them from being power-mongers because I was under one at one time and the pastor was not having it. You would be out of order by telling the pastor anything about being wrong about something. The danger here is losing your congregation little by little and disobeying God by lording over them. I believe prayer in needed first and with the okay of God go to that person with the elders of the church and discuss the issue.

[smurf1948]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

We must find humble servants that want to serve the church and God. Our pastor knows what is going on in our church is from God not because of himself. He always gives the glory to God. This the kind of leaders we need in churches. They need to derve the body not looking for the body to serve them.

[Rosie1Rose]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

The only true way is accountability before God through Church Elders. I knew a Pastor without Elders and he made some seriously damaging decisions. With Elders, you have a sounding board, people who care, who will pray and fast and correct you when you are wrong.

If a pastor is not willing to come under the guidance and authority of his elders then you have to question whether he is truly under God's authority.

Leadership in Church has to be carried out under God's authority whether we think He is right or not. If there is a silence, we wait for an answer or search ourselves for sin.

Look at the Old Testament to see the problem of choosing leaders outside of God's guidance and authority

[kenny]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

First up I believe if the pastor was appointed in accordance with scriptural norms, the above scenarios hopefully would not exist. More often than not problems of authority go beyond the financial realms and are more prevalent in basic running of the assembly

[kenny]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

First up I believe if the pastor was appointed in accordance with scriptural norms, the above scenarios hopefully would not exist. More often than not problems of authority go beyond the financial realms and are more prevalent in basic running of the assembly

[kenny]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

First up I believe if the pastor was appointed in accordance with scriptural norms, the above scenarios hopefully would not exist. More often than not problems of authority go beyond the financial realms and are more prevalent in basic running of the assembly

[servant for Christ]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

To be sure that they love God and are committed to God with all their hear. That they fear the Lord with all their heart. The pastor's authority isn't limited when he is following God's leading, listening and obeying the Holy Spirit, a true pastor does not consider the church his, but the Lord's. When the pastor is putting his flock before himself in everything, you will know he is a man of God. I think the test we can do, is the test that Jesus did for his disciples. Use the word to test. I think it can be difficult if we don't pray, meditate on God's word, ask his guidance. We can deal with it by praying, and seeking God's face and guidance for every situation that occurs. Staying on our knees if need be.

'

[hanks]

Q3. (5:3)

How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers?

From limiting a pastor's authority?

What's the danger here?

From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult?

How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

The world thinks of leaders as being confident, self-assured and assertive. In contrast Peter tells us that our leaders are to be humble and a servant of others. In our churches we often see Christians that tend to measure leaders in terms of their success, whereas in the Scriptures they were measured in terms of their faithfulness. When we introduce a Christian speaker, we boast of their educational achievements, their success in ministry (usually measured in numbers), and their acceptance by men. Even when we seek to recruit leaders, we appeal to men on a human level, according to human pride and ambition. We want them to think of leadership as an honour rather than a means of expressing humility. We speak to them about feeling fulfilled rather than of emptying themselves in service to others. So there is a vastly different way unbelievers lead and the way it should be in our churches. Our leaders are not to be self-seeking, self-serving, and self-sufficient but humble in their relationship to God and to men. We desperately need to embrace Peter

[Old Jerry]

We can best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers by judging their input to the situations that rise out of committee meetings. That is also the way that we can limit a pastor

[Guitar Jim]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here?

I've attended a church where the pastor's authority was limited by the despotic elders. The pastor was never really in charge. Every time he quoted Scripture in his sermons he had to also quote chapter and verse, which often interrupted the flow of his sermons. The elders, a husband and wife team, ruled that church with an iron hand. When the old woman died earlier this year some of the former congregation actually danced on her grave! They rejected the authority of their denomination's leadership and that small church actually became a cult. They claimed they and they only had the true interpretation of the Bible and its applications for our lives. They went through pastors like grain through a goose and in one year three pastors resigned! The only person they could fully trust to implement their will over the congregation was their only begotten son and so they sent him to America to study to be a pastor at a theological college they trusted. Look hard enough and you'll find a teaching institution that'll teach you only what you want to know. That church is no more. They building is now used for something else entirely.

From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult?

How do you test a potential leader to see if he's going to become drunk with power? Put him on probation? That'll make him keen to do his job from his heart . . . not! You can't anoint an elder on a trial basis. Once you anoint a man by laying on hands and blessing him in the name of the Lord you can't make it provisional on his not becoming power mad. If you've made a bad decision you have to live with it.

The church I attended for ten years in the 1980s didn't actually have appointed elders for that very reason. Whenever something came up that required the wisdom and insight of mature responsible Christian men the pastor called a few guys who fit the bill and they put their heads together under the authority of Christ. I've battled health issues for decades and one time I approached the pastor for Biblical healing as prescribed in the book of James. While we had no anointed elders as such, the men who came to my home to lay hands on me had my utmost trust and confidence as Godly men, full of wisdom. These men were doing the job of elders without actually being officially appointed as such. That makes a lot of sense really. If they begin to overstep their authority and lord it over people the pastor could simply not include them in the church's decision making and other important duties. By not being officially called elders they had no real power that could go to their heads. At the same time though, they had the utmost trust of the membership.

How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

We had a pastor who was clearly out of the will of God toward the end of my time at that church. He preached the same sermon every Sunday for two years: We need revival and we need to go full on Pentecostal. We were essentially a reformed kind of church. There are lots of people who are nominally Baptist who have no permanent church membership. They're what I call "floaters". When a church calls a new pastor and he's a known revivalist the floaters soon hear of it and start attending that church. They take on deacon positions when they become vacant and soon the pastor has a support team that will back him in the paradigm shift he wants to implement. That happened to us. The issue of whether we should become a Pentecostal church or remain a reformed church split the membership in half. Many left and the floaters soon were close to a majority. The unofficial elders, however, stood firm and along with much prayer and soul searching they opposed the pastor publicly and he quit one Sunday mid-sermon! I heard that from someone who was still there. I'd walked out mid-service a year before. My little daughter said: Daddy church isn't finished yet. I said loudly enough for all to hear: This church is finished as long as that heretic is in the pulpit!

[wifee]

3a)Seek God’s help to find right person, as in 1 Timothy Chapters 3-6. Pau’s guidance for determining leadership. Above reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, not given to drunkenness, not violent, but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money, etc.

b)The churches constitution can place ultimate decision in hands of church body,rather than pastor.Treasurers handling money not pastors

C)Problems if pastor doesn’t listen to people &/or God for guidance.

D)People’s skills in leadership can be tested in small gps,lesser matters before affirming pastor training. E)Some churches run by lay people with limited accountability.

[elizabeth kerr]

Our best hope for keeping an elder or a pastor from becoming a power-hungry, domineering "overlord" of the congregation is

1) to pray much for wisdom from God in choosing each  elder and pastor

2) to pray for each candidate for office:  for his relationship with Jesus, his spiritual growth and maturity, his increasing knowledge of Scripture, his increasing agape-love for God and for other people, his humility and humbling before God

3) to examine each candidate's character, life, past history looking carefully at the qualifications for an elder/deacon in 1 Timothy 3: his relationships in his family, his relationships with other believers in and out of this congregation, his relationships with his superiors and his subordinates on the job, his knowledge of God, his knowledge of Scripture, his beliefs, his secular philosophical beliefs

4) to pray for God to make an inappropriate candidate remove himself from consideration for office

5) to pray for God to make obvious any evidence that a particular candidate should be rejected

****Our search for and choosing of an elder or a pastor must be done slowly, patiently, carefully, and without prejudice, but with a turning-over-every-rock-to-see-what-if-any-bugs-crawl-out-from-underneath attitude.

^^We must be excessively cautious because we are too easily deceived and because too many people are trying to deceive us just as we are trying to deceive them.

 

There should be some limits to an elder's or a pastor's authority.  A lot of prayer  for wisdom from God and Bible study on the particular limitations being considered are needed before any specific limitation is adopted by the congregaton by a HUGE majority.

A near-even result means the congregation is seriously divided on this issue and a lot more prayer, Bible study, and "listening to the other side and really thinking about what they are saying" is needed before any final decision is  made.

   But limits are needed because pastors and elders are just as messed up and sinful as the rest of us, and their power grabs can destroy the congregation.   It is highly unlikely that the power-hungry leader will leave the congregation before he has done severe damage to those who remain; sometimes it is the leader who leaves first but just as often it is the regular members who flee.

 

A person cannot be offered the position of elder or pastor on a probationary basis; so, our "testing" has to be done by seriously and conscienciously vetting the candidate before he is offered the position.  But even the best vetting job will not guarantee that the person offered the position is the right one.  This is because all of us tend to hide our flaws, weaknesses, and sins and to exaggerate the good for the sake of our reputation, especially when we are hoping for a leadership position.

[Craig]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

 

 

We can best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers by getting involved in our church.  In many instances church leaders become power-mongers because church members don't want to get involved and take on responsibilities.   So church leadership ends taking on that responsibility and what appears to be power-mongering.   When the congregation will not and in order to get jobs done, church leadership takes care of it and it winds up dividing placing more decision-making into the hands of the few, not by choice, out of necessity. 

 

On the other hand there are some leaders who genuinely seek power for personal power sake.  They need to be held accountable by the church.  The job interview process should help screen this kind of leader out.  However, sometimes the tendencies  of people don't reveal themselves until they are placed into a position.  This can be addressed by a church personnel board or council to regularly review leadership performance. This board can call attention to both effective leadership and problem areas in the leader's performance.  As part of the screening process for a job the purpose of this board would be brought to the attention of the potential leader.

 

The church as a whole must emphasize that church leadership is to be carried out in humility and servant hood.  Jesus is the model.

 

[lighthouse2014]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

To keep an elder or pastor from being a power-monger we should choose a person who is qualified for the job, a man of God and most of all a humble person, willing to serve the people.

A pastor's authority should be limited by the counsel of church elders who oversee the church.

The danger here is that if a pastor is allowed to do as he wishes he may become greedy for money and become self centered.

A person should be tested before given authority, he should be humble and willing to serve or Sheppard the church. His past history would be a good indicator of his character.

This testing could be difficult if the elders of the church are not diligent in their jobs and not knowing how to test a person.

To deal with a person who has become self centered, eager for gain and over ruling his authority should be brought before the elders for correcting. If the person in the leadership position is resistant or non compliance is the result, the person should be removed from his leadership position.   

[Celtic Wanderer]

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

We all need to be discipled.  We need to walk alongside people who are an example to us.  If it is necessary to limit a pastor’s power this proves that they are not yet ready to take the position - period. Yes we need to test candidates before bestowing authority – they must prove to be faithful in the small things and then they can be given greater responsibility. We must never rush.  There is wisdom in a multitude of counsellors – for this reason it is wise never to make an appointment without having the council of other wise leaders/mature persons.  Someone may detect something that we can’t see – we must allow those people to speak and to carefully consider their words. A timid lady may have a lot of wisdom and if we help her to share what she sees we may be saved from many heartaches.

[elaineer]

3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

---By keeping regular meetings with the Councillors and memners of the church.

---We cannot test a person unless we have given them the opportunity to prove themselves worthy. 

---We need to pray and then confront the issue.

[Christopher Olamiji Taiwo]

On 4/18/2004 at 4:13 AM, Pastor Ralph said:

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

The best way to keep elders and pastors from being power mongers is being take good care of them by paying good salary other incentives and monitor their activities. The danger in limiting the pastor's authority will result into unnecessary excuses by not been responsible and reliable on his duties. Testing before bestowing authority is very difficult because human being are very difficult to understand. The only way is committing all things to God in prayers and watch.

[charisbarak]

Leaders need to be accountable to each other and to the church itself.

Same.  Our pastor is considered an elder at our church.  He is humble and accountable as well.

Yes, they need to be a mature Christian and spend time being tested before taking over his responsibilities.  They need to be paid a  suitable amount.  It takes much time & prayer in making those decisions. We as a body need to be in prayer as well for our elders--that they would have wisdom and discernment in making decisions.   Seek the Lord & His face!

[blezed]

On 4/18/2004 at 0:13 AM, Pastor Ralph said:

Q3. (5:3) How can we best keep elders and pastors from being power-mongers? From limiting a pastor's authority? What's the danger here? From testing a person before bestowing authority? How can this be difficult? How can we deal with this serious problem properly?

First of all, Jesus warns against this kind of leadership.  We must go in prayer for the Lord to send a humble servant.  One that would lead by following Jesus' example, which is to serve the people.  As long as an elder or pastor is following Jesus' example, there would be no reason to limit his/her authority for they would do the right thing.