God's child Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 God's Word says you can't have faith without works. You cannot have either without the other, otherwise they are dead. When we walk in obedience to God it involves work. Whatever he has designed for each of us to do. Most of the time the things He asks us to do requires a great deal of faith, other times not as much, but with everything we do for Him, faith is needed. As a child of God, you cannot live with one and not the other unless you simply choose to be an unhappy Christian. God's Word says our salvation is free. Just as with faith being dead without works and also works without faith, salvation would not be free without God's grace. We cannot do anything to deserve His grace and salvation. He loves us so much that He gives it to us without charge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markle Posted October 20, 2008 Report Share Posted October 20, 2008 GOD designed the plan. Sacrifice was to be killed and burned at the altar. The blood was sprinkled over the sinner as an atonement of sins. Jesus was the perfect lamb of GOD to atone for all man sins. JESUS blood must be sprinkled over the sinner as GOD plan dictates. You can not be forgiven without the sprinkling of the blood of JESUS. The blood washed ours sins away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SScott Posted November 4, 2008 Report Share Posted November 4, 2008 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) I believe that forgiveness and obedience goes hand in hand because without obedience you won't have the discipline to forgive someone. You have to work at forgiveness and being obedient. Only the Lord Jesus Christ was born with forgiveness and obedience. We are saved by grace instead of works because it shows that Jesus had to die for our sins, because no matter what we do we could decide to be good but no works is good enough in God's eyes to say that we're saved, only the death of Jesus his Son was the only act great enough to wash away our sins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csreeves Posted December 24, 2008 Report Share Posted December 24, 2008 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) Forgiveness must be the other side of a double sided coin with the other side is obedience for if we can't forgive then we can't be forgiven nor can we obey Christ with true obedience for it is only through him can true willingness and openess be available. True faith requires obedience. We can't earn our way with works for we were born humanly falable-imperfect, sinners that can only be saved by grace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blessed7 Posted January 27, 2009 Report Share Posted January 27, 2009 Sprinkling and obedience are together for they are one. The blood of Jesus cleans us( the temple) of sins, allowing the Holy Spirit to fill us. Enabling us to do the works that we were called and created for, thus being obedient to God. It is so we can be "sprinkled" that Jesus was cruxified, the shedding of His blood for our sins, so we can be forgiven by the Father,( having been born in sin through Adam and Eve) washed in the Blood of the Lamb,( a new or second birth) being able to draw nigh unto Him, under His protective arm, bathe in His love. It is through disobedience that we are seperated from our Father, lead down a path of destruction and death. Sin is disobedience. To be cleansed is to be filled , to be filled is to obey, it is the path home. Faith in the resurrection of Jesus , understanding that He suffered for us , guided by the Holy Spirit, we are lead down the path of righteouness. All of our righteouness is as filthy rags,it is by the grace and mercy of the Heavenly Father who sent His only begotten Son to suffer and die on the cross , that we have salvation. We were dead in sin, reborn thru Christ Jesus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainwater Posted March 10, 2009 Report Share Posted March 10, 2009 2 Timothy 1:9 (New International Version) 9who has saved us and called us to a holy life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainwater Posted March 10, 2009 Report Share Posted March 10, 2009 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) Forgiveness and obedience come together as a package, because when u r forgiven u r made pure and clean, and with obedience, as obeying God, we r to be like God, pure and clean, and act in accordance with God's ways. To live life righteously, and to be like Jesus Christ in all of our thoughts, actions, and our words. It can be deceptive because one can think that he/ she is forgiven, he/she can think that okay i am forgiven, and they forget the part that we have to live our lives being godly. obeying God, and living our lives as God wants us to live them. Matthew 7:21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Nice post, Karey. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenny Posted April 28, 2009 Report Share Posted April 28, 2009 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) Our salvation requires us to live in obedience to the word of our Lord.It was through the cleansing of His blood that washed away our sins and His resurrection the we are reborn.Without obedience we have a false hope and belief ,no fruits will be borne.This being the case we will be pruded back like a branch of vine that bears no fruit. I think that many in our faith could do well to have a in depth study as to the true meaning of the word "WORKS" when it comes to our salvation because it seems to have bean blown out of proportion.Jesus did all the "Work" when it comes to salvation and through His Grace we are saved their is no other way. Our works as Christians are simply a manifestation of the Holy Spirit in our lives without which we are like an empty barrel hollow and dry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
servant for Christ Posted May 4, 2009 Report Share Posted May 4, 2009 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) It comes as a package because we have to obey His word, we have to listen and follow His direction. Jesus is the High Priest. He sacrificed his blood to atone for our sins and for the forgiveness of our sins. That is why we can't have one without the other. EXTRA CREDIT: We are saved by grace because our salvation comes as a gift of God's grace for we are his workmanship. Grace is God's presence and love through Christ Jesus given to believers by the Holy Spirit and imparting to them mercy, forgiveness, and the desire and power to do God's will. God gives grace to believers to be made free from sin, to will and to do of his good pleasure, to pray, to grow in Christ, to witness for Christ, and the obedience to the will of God demanded by Christ is indeed an ongoing condition for salvation, but Christ also declares that is is a grace belonging to the salvation of the kingdom. We must continually pray for it, receive it, and put it into effect by a sincere faith and earnest endeavor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boham Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10). We cannot have a heart of forgiveness unless we are following Christ and being obedient to His word. His word tells us to forgive and without obedience why do anything His word tells us to do ?If we have true faith,obedience will follow plain and simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WFC Posted June 1, 2009 Report Share Posted June 1, 2009 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) I believe that forgiveness and obedience come as a package because if one is not obedient to God's Word then he cannot have forgiveness. I say this because God's Word says: to forgive so we can be forgiven. If one is not walking in forgiveness then in-turn he is walking is disobedience. One cannot half way obey God. In-fact partial obedience is disobedience. I feel that this leads to another situation that cause Christians to get stuck and that is trying to separate obedience from sacrifice. I don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrspotsie Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) There are two parts to true salvation, God's giving of it and our accepting it. God did not force salvation on us, He offers forgivness. By accepting His gift of salvation, we already are being obedient by recognizing our need for Him and His gift. "To obey is better than sacrifice." God desires our obedience so He can give us all the blessings He wishes to bestow, but He offers forgiveness because He knows we are not perfect. To rely on God's forgiveness without our obedience is to disgrace His gift and His sacrifice. God knows our sinful nature, which is why we cannot have salvation through works. We would never be good enough. But, after we see His grace, we desire to obey and do good works to show our love for Him. "Faith without works is dead." For example, how would your family know you love them if you never showed them? Our works prove our love for God to others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smurf1948 Posted August 1, 2009 Report Share Posted August 1, 2009 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? I believe once your forgiven it just comes natural to want to be obedient to the one who granted you forgiveness. Once we accept his forgives I think our next step with even giving thought to it would obedience. If don't then I don't believe forgiveness was given. Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? If were not being obedient and folowing Gods word and living in it then it would be foolishness to believe we are forgiven. This is all part of the gift God gives usas our loving father. When this kind of love is given you want to be obedient. If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? By grace we are saved. Once you accept it you want to be obedient. It comes with the acceptance of grace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Weir Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) Redemption through the blood of Jesus only happens when we are obedient to His teachings. We are all sinners but need to strive for these 2 areas of our Christian lives. Forgiveness and redemption are closely linked & can only happen when we are obedient. Faith and good works go together. Our destiny is partly to do the will of God and we need to believe, obey, follow, be controlled and be led by Jesus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seanbowes Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) We cannot receive forgiveness if we are not obedient to God. Matthew 6:14 - 15 confirms this. There is a condition, forgive others, or you won't be forgiven. We have to obey that condition. We need to be obedient to God to please God, and to be truely obedient, we need fiath, and without faith it is impossible to please God. Romans 8:28 states that God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose (obedience). That is why forgiveness and obedience come together as a package. We are not saved by our works, but through the grace of God. However, if we have faith in God, we will be obedient to Him and this obedience requires that we do works as He wants us to. We wil want to go out in the world and preach, and take food to orphans etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Weir Posted September 13, 2009 Report Share Posted September 13, 2009 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) Redemption through the blood of Jesus only happens when we are obedient to His teachings. We are all sinners but need to strive for these 2 areas of our Christian lives. Forgiveness and redemption are closely linked & can only happen when we are obedient. Faith and good works go together. Our destiny is partly to do the will of God and we need to believe, obey, follow, be controlled and be led by Jesus. Sean, I do see you living out your faith, obedience and forgiveness of others in your daily life. I commend you for your commitment to your Christian life and will in my life try to follow you as a role-player. Your love for your Lord shines through in everything you do, and I admire the example you set. I often think of my leaving the Church of Christ for personal reasons that are unacceptable to my Lord Jesus. My family commitment is one of them, but I am not strong enough to relinquish the example I try to set to my family, after trying very hard to engage Gerda in the obedience that the C of C was projecting and that she wouldn't accept. I can only trust that in the fulness of time she will come to an understanding of what true Christian obedience really is. Meanwhile we keep our faith and do what good works we can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miss peggy wilson Posted October 26, 2009 Report Share Posted October 26, 2009 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) Forgiveness and obedience goes hand in hand. We cannot effective followers of Jesus Christ unless we are obedient to His word.Forgiving one another is a command from God. If we think we can be obedient to God only and not forgiving one another we are only deceiving ourselves. We didnot and cannot save our selves We ae saved by grace through faith which is a gift from God. Our works will never be good enough to save us this gift comes strictly from God. True faith cause us to be obedient in every way. True faith causes us to trust and obey and forgive regardless of the circumstances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceecee Posted November 16, 2009 Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 IF YOU BELIEVE IN JESUS THEN YOU HAVE TO OBEY HIM TO RECEIVE THE FULL BENEFITS OF A BELIVER. IF YOU BELIEVE HIM BUT YOU DO NOT OBEY HIM YOU HAVE LITTLE FAITH IN HIM AND YOU HAVE TO HAVE FAITH TO PLEASE GOD.NOW WE KNOW THAT WE ARE FILTHY RAGS TO HIM. WE WILL ALWAYS SIN BUT WE SHOULD TRY TO SIN LESS. HE IS A FAITHFUL GOD AND HE IS FAITHFUL AND JUST AND WILL FORGIVE US IF WE REPENT.WE DO NOT HAVE TO KEEP COMMITING THE SAME SIN OVER AND OVER. WE MUST PRAY FOR DELIVERANCE FOR THAT SIN AND GOD WILL DELIVER US FROM IT.LIKE PAUL SAID IN ROMANS THE VERY THING IDONT WANT TO DO IS THE VERYL THING I DO. EXTRA CREDIT--CHRISTIANS HAVE BEEN SAVED BY GRACE.THE GRACE OF GOD IS THE SOURCE OF SALVATION.PAUL SAYS THAT OUR BELIEF IN GOD DOES NOT COME FROM OURSELVES BUT EVERYTHING COMES FROM OUR FATHER. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose L Posted November 24, 2009 Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) Went Jesus was in phisical body here on earth he said many time "your sins are forgiveng go in peace" The teachers of the law do not beleive it because they could not see this forgiving thing also because they believe the only one to forgive was God the Father and for last they did not humble themselves and give it a try to experiecence this action of forgiving on them . Went we accept Jesus as our savior and we recognise he give his blood for the forgiving of the sins we humble our selves in a act of abidience we do not know what is going to happen but we obey to what he come to this world and this is why we can not have salvation without admit Jesus give his blood for this world for the forgiving of all sins . Is clear by self will to refuse it or to humble our selves and in act of obidience accept is real . The next is after we accept and believe we experiece freeadom from our sins we feel theyre not more there in our faith increase more in obey Jesus message is not a practical thing is a transformation to a new life by the spirit blood was need it to have forgiviness and to be transform but if we do not believe this new born can not occurt that also why we can not have forgiveness with out believe is real. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gailh Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 I see two aspects to the relationship of forgiveness and obedience: First, forgiveness is necessary to obedience because, no matter how hard we try, we simply cannot truly obey God on our own. Our obedience is always imperfect, and in need of the lavish redemption and forgiveness accomplished by Christ. Reference: Romans 3:22-24 This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. Secondly, the proper reason for our effort at obedience is gratitude for God's amazing forgiveness (as opposed to earning God's favor). If we could actually obey 100%, we'd be able to boast in ourselves -- something that the world encourages. But because God constantly shores us up with his gift of forgiveness even as we attempt to obey him, we are then moved to boast in God and His great love and compassion, and be humble about our own tainted actions. How thankful I am when the Spirit takes my marred motives and works through me anyway. The glory all goes to God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ieshea Posted December 14, 2009 Report Share Posted December 14, 2009 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) In order to be forgiven, we have to first confess, agree with God, that we are wrong. Then this leads to forgiveness. Having faith is a part of obedience. Without faith you will not obey. Faith is an action word. Abraham's faith was tested by an action that he had to do with Isaac. We can say that we are saved by grace and not works because salvation is a gift from God. There is nothing that we could have done to earn it. God gives us the faith that we have to believe and obey. So that is why we can say that we are saved by grace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emccoy Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 This is an interesting and very thought provoking question. Here is my stab at it: Faith and obedience come together because they are cyclical. In order to have faith, you must first be obedient to God by giving your heart to him (becoming saved). By the same token, you cannot demonstrate obedience without first having faith. To whom would you be obedient to if you do not have faith in Him? So, I guess which came first--- the chicken or the egg? The next question is pretty tough, but maybe overly simple at the same time. We are saved by grace because quite simply God's grace (allowing us to live day by day even in our sin; loving us unconditionally even in our sin, etc) allows us to become saved. Not a single soul on this earth deserves to be saved and no amount works can measure up to the love that God has for us. Due to our sinful nature and God's unconditional loving nature, it would only be by grace that we could be saved and never by works. Did I already say that there could never be enough works to cover our sins---only the blood of Jesus (who never sinned) could cover our sins-- and only God's grace would allow us to be covered by His blood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gann Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 Forgiveness and Obedience comes together as a package because if we understand that we need forgiveness we must be willing to forgive. For Jesus said in Mat. 6:14,15; "For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive you." So in order for one to work you must be willing to do the other. To think that we can have one without the other we are just fooling our self. For it is very selfish to just want all the time and not be willing to give something in return even though the world is a lot that way with God now days. But how can we understand what Christ done for us and not be willing to follow Him in obedience. For Samuel told King Saul that it is better to obey than to sacrifice. (1Sam.15:22). If where not willing to obey how can we expect anything from God. Obedience is not what saves us it is just a natural act of love once we receive Christ into our hearts. For Jesus said "If you believe in me the works that I do you will do also and greater works will you do because I go unto my Father".(John 14:12). If we truly believe in Christ then are we changed and become a new creature, a creature of Obedience. So the works does not save us they are just the sign that we are saved. For the scripture says "You shall know them by their fruits".(Mat.7:16). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donna2 Posted January 11, 2010 Report Share Posted January 11, 2010 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) when I asked Jesus to forgive me of my sins I became a new child so I show my obiendance to the Lord by being sprinkling and in faith I will follow him in all things daily Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rambler Posted January 11, 2010 Report Share Posted January 11, 2010 Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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